rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 1 minute ago, PenkethBoy said: How do you know it not doing that? do you have any details of how you know it works easily Prooven by looking on the NAS (windows share) to see WHO is accessing the file - the Shield or the Emby server - it's the emby server ... NOT the shield ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdatanet 1549 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, PenkethBoy said: How do you know it not doing that? do you have any details of how you know it works Documentation says that some applications can use the direct path, developers should specify what those applications are. I think the Shield does not use the direct path, if not, this problem would not exist. Edited September 27, 2020 by vdatanet 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenkethBoy 2063 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 I did it two ways in testing In the library setup - i just gave the library a unc path to the media - i then did it with a mapped folder path - results were the same with emby server as man in the middle what i did not do is also fill in the optional path maybe you need to put the unc path in twice - did not try that - but would be easy for somebody to test if it makes a difference Unless the text is telling porkies like similar text for sync Enabling the external player is not the issue as i see it (subject to some actual info from the devs) - thats a work around not directly relevant to the issue of pausing - as the parameters change drastically Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) The Optional UNC/SMB path are not used - for the Shield Client anyway - I have these set. I *think* the only client that uses these is the Windows Media Center .. Again - easy to see, as the access will be coming from a different host - 2 secs and I'll test ... Edit - Nope, Windows Theatre does not use SMB Direct either - same problem as all the other clients. Edited September 27, 2020 by rbjtech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenkethBoy 2063 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 14 minutes ago, rbjtech said: easily Prooven by looking on the NAS (windows share) to see WHO is accessing the file - the Shield or the Emby server - it's the emby server ... NOT the shield ... but if thats correct the video would stream through the emby server and it does not appear to do that - as there is not enough network traffic on the middleman server to be even close to doing that when the shield is playing the file Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 I'm not sure why you are saying it is not passing through the emby server - as in my case, it clearly is .. ? These screen grabs are FROM the NAS. The reading host is the emby server (media.rbjtech.lan in my case) - if the shield was reading it - then it would say 'shield.rbjtech.lan' ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdatanet 1549 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 This post is very useful for me, I am running out of internal storage and this Christmas I wanted to expand it with an external NAS. This changes everything, right now I don't know what to do. Can anyone with Linux server mounting external NFS shares confirm if this happens too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenkethBoy 2063 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 Yep - you are correct it is going through the server - when i did the tests last night i must have miss read the network traffic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 This is via the Emby Client .. If and only if I select to use the External Player (VLC) - does the shield itself get the file directly from my 'NAS' (Windows SMB Share) .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenkethBoy 2063 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 which i what i would expect the emby atv client to do by default - but clearly does not 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) Agreed - I can't seem to install the Windows 10 Theatre Client on my desktop comes up with 'files corrupt in deployment..) Hmm... But i think that may be able to use SMB directly. It would be great if the Dev's can just tell us which clients can use SMB ! (but I appreciate it's night/early am in the US...) edit - To add - just tried the LG Native Emby App - Exactly the same crunch point as the Shield and browser - at 50 Mbit/sec works ok, at 55 Mbit/sec - it stalls. edit 2 - Finally got the Windows 10 Theatre App to install (has to use the MS App Store..) - but exactly the same issue. So it does not use SMB Direct either. So I think it's reasonable to conclude that the issue is not related to the clients - but it is the emby server SMB>HTTP conversion that is the problem here ? Edited September 27, 2020 by rbjtech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 13 minutes ago, vdatanet said: This post is very useful for me, I am running out of internal storage and this Christmas I wanted to expand it with an external NAS. This changes everything, right now I don't know what to do. Can anyone with Linux server mounting external NFS shares confirm if this happens too? Other options are to keep it DAS - and use USB3 or possibly eSATA or eSAS to expand the storage. In this thread, there was talk of NFS - I've not used it myself, but improvement was as I understand it marginal. It would be good to see if an NFS 'mounted' disk has the same problems - as I suspect, this would be using an entirely different network 'stack' and emby 'should' see this as a local disk as presumably it doesn't have direct NFS support ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdatanet 1549 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 7 hours ago, rbjtech said: It would be good to see if an NFS 'mounted' disk has the same problems - as I suspect, this would be using an entirely different network 'stack' and emby 'should' see this as a local disk as presumably it doesn't have direct NFS support ? I'm working on it. Synology NAS with single 1 Gb NIC, Ubuntu Server with single 1 Gb NIC mounting Synology NFS Shares. System is up, just copying some 4K material to the NAS. I will report back later. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 I'm in Wireshark analysing packets - but currently can't see anything obviously wrong but I'm trying to match the 'pause' to the packet flow ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBers 6771 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 10 hours ago, cayars said: @Luke, @ebr can you guys take a look at this please. There is definitely a bottleneck in Emby causing this as it doesn't happen with some other media server software. No interest as yet from the devs 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo 4330 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 1 hour ago, rbjtech said: I'm in Wireshark analysing packets - but currently can't see anything obviously wrong but I'm trying to match the 'pause' to the packet flow ... I doubt you'll see anything wrong at that level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 1 hour ago, cayars said: I doubt you'll see anything wrong at that level. Yea there way nothing wrong with the stream - just a constant run of SMB requests with ACK for each, no obvious gaps inbetween during the 'stutters' either, that's what I was looking for. I'm more likely to see that at the client end tbh (if at all) but really need somebody who knows how HLS works - as doing a quick bit of R&D on it today, it looks fairly involved with 'profiles' and such like - way too involved to even start to understand on a Sunday afternoon .. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdatanet 1549 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, rbjtech said: but really need somebody who knows how HLS works While direct playing HLS has nothing to do, the file is delivered using http protocol instead of smb, but it's not repacked using HLS. Data is fetched from the storage server using SMB and delivered to the client using http, that "conversion" is problematic with high bitrates. But file is not repacked using HLS. Edited September 27, 2020 by vdatanet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sooty234 266 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) 12 hours ago, rbjtech said: (*) @sooty234 - Are you saying with a 10Gb Networks using a NAS (SMB) - 10Gb -> Emby (10Gb) -> Shield (1Gb) - you are NOT seeing pause issues ? Correct. Both my storage and server are 10G. With Shield either on WiFi or wired, it plays correctly. If I make a library on a device with a 1G link, still using the server on 10G, then I get the pausing. 10G storage --> 10G server --> 1G Shield = no pausing. 1G storage --> 10G server --> 1G shield = playback pauses every minute or so. Something to add here, is that my storage and server are connected via SFP+. I would think that may play a part. Edited September 27, 2020 by sooty234 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 14 minutes ago, vdatanet said: While direct playing HLS has nothing to do, the file is delivered using http protocol instead of smb, but it's not repacked using HLS. Data is fetched from the storage server using SMB and delivered to the client using http, that "conversion" is problematic with high bitrates. But file is not repacked using HLS. ok - as I said, I'm not sure how it works - we need the Dev's to advise. the only reason I mentioned HLS is my logs are full of '/hls1/main/' paths - but looking more, this is just transcoding. It says 'stream type : HLS' in stats for nerds .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbjtech 4287 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 21 minutes ago, sooty234 said: Correct. Both my storage and server are 10G. With Shield either on WiFi or wired, it plays correctly. If I make a library on a device with a 1G link, still using the server on 10G, then I get the pausing. 10G storage --> 10G server --> 1G Shield = no pausing. 1G storage --> 10G server --> 1G shield = playback pauses every minute or so. Something to add here, is that my storage and server are connected via SFP+. I would think that may play a part. So the 2nd scenario is to be expected - as I guess that is ultimately no different to a 1Gig only network as the 10G will just neg down to 1gig. But I'm very intrigued why 10Gig SMB doesn't have the issue - is it just standard 10Gig drivers ? SMB2 ? Are they on the same subnet as the clients or is the 'storage network' using it's own subnet ? VLAN's ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sooty234 266 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, rbjtech said: So the 2nd scenario is to be expected - as I guess that is ultimately no different to a 1Gig only network as the 10G will just neg down to 1gig. But I'm very intrigued why 10Gig SMB doesn't have the issue - is it just standard 10Gig drivers ? SMB2 ? Are they on the same subnet as the clients or is the 'storage network' using it's own subnet ? VLAN's ? No storage network. Everything is on the same subnet. The NICs on server and storage are Mellanox ConnectX-2 (using DAC SFP+), with the standard Windows drivers. I do have VLANs but they are for other things, and play no part in this. I wonder if XG switch is working some magic. I'll try connecting the shield to the same switch and see what happens... Edited September 27, 2020 by sooty234 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vdatanet 1549 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 24 minutes ago, sooty234 said: The NICs on server and storage are Mellanox ConnectX-2 Those NICs are RDMA capable, maybe more important than 10 Gb: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/previous-versions/windows/it-pro/windows-server-2012-R2-and-2012/jj134210(v=ws.11) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sooty234 266 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 The same issue exists when I connect them both to the same switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sooty234 266 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) I just added vertigo to the test library on my HTPC. This machine also has 10G but an Intel X540 NIC. When playing on the shield, with this configuration, the pausing not only happens, but is more pronounced. It's pausing every few seconds. @vdatanet I had suspected the ConneX-2 NICs played a part. This would suggest they do. Edited September 27, 2020 by sooty234 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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