Spaceboy 2494 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Well I presume all the complainers here are either constantly on a YouTube forum moaning away at having to watch an advert before their video or just never use youtube? Agree with deathsquirrel, the list proposed by catsrules is not really helpful. I mean no one watches the credits as it is! Is anyone going to even notice a reminder at the end? The only thing I would say is to make it less frequent, maybe on every other video watched. But it has to be in the current undismissable format otherwise it won't have the intended effect. And yes that is to drive away free loaders (even those that put themselves in that category). The idea that people that would have become subscribers but are now put off by the nag screen is frankly laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIMan 0 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 You know what's worse than people complaining about so called 'free' software? People that think $100 gives them a hall monitor pass. It's like a virtual Trump Rally here. Don't listen to anything but what's inside the echo chamber. Disrespect everybody who disagrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mevlock 1 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 (edited) As a new user I thought my option may be relevant. I like Emby I really do. Not enough to pay out for a lifetime sub or a monthly fee though. It's not exactly cheap. I also wouldn't use ANY of the perks that come from paying. None of them are of interest to me. I mainly watch via the Kodi plugin. Or at least will be, I'm in the process of migrating from Plex. I have however paid for the the Android client (twice, for me and the wife) and the Apple client (for my daughter). I'd also be fine with paying a small upfront charge for the web client. Edited February 20, 2017 by Mevlock 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinmd88 20 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Regardless of whether you've paid for Emby Premiere or not, access to your own media is unaffected by Emby itself. As someone else pointed out, you are free to double-click any of your files in your file system browser of choice and have at it. What's being "ad-walled" is your ability to use Emby to do it, and that's their call, not yours. I'm laughing to myself about how a self-proclaimed developer would have difficulty understanding this concept of separation. If Windows Explorer had a fee associated with its use, you would either pay to use it or find something else to do it with. If you're not OK with having to pay, then go find something else, nobody here is going to miss your null contributions and the forums will not miss your smug attempts at rhetoric. And even if Emby were the only choice in the world you had to access your media, you'd still have no leg to stand on, as you're always more than welcome (especially as a developer!) to design your own means or pay someone else to for you. As for the nag-banner itself, it could probably use some tweaking if it's like that 15 seconds before every video, maybe a less-intrusive number of occurrences like every X videos as someone mentioned, I've been lifetime premiere since the donation days so I wouldn't necessarily know or care myself. But you are not entitled to a damn thing as a free user, and to claim that you deserve a say in a product you have not contributed anything to financially will get you nowhere still. Maybe Emby needs improvements, but it's gonna take a lot more than a handful of freeloaders for any company with this kind of support to feel the squeeze of your campaign there. And lastly, I'd be flattered at the "fanboy" title. I'll keep it in mind as I sit on a comfy leather couch and enjoy my stuff with a system I like and support, while Joe Coder curses under his breath at Emby's stonewalling his every attempt to double-click a video in his file system. If you like an ad-free experience, buy it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathsquirrel 741 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Just a thought on price. I have about 1500 movies. Generally I pay about $9 each for those. Historically I'm sure my average is higher than that but let's say $9 for movies so that's $13,500 on current movies. Of course about 500 of those were double dips where I replaced. DVD with a blu-ray. Now we're at 18,000. Throw in my TV and music and I'm easily at $25,000 sunk into media. The server and all that storage are a couple grand. Add in the AV equipment, electricity to run it all, etc. You get my point I hope, this isn't a cheap hobby. The software that makes all of that manageable and actually usable for me currently sells for $100. I spent several times that on binders to store all those freaking discs. Sure, I know that some of us spent more and others spent less but for those of us not pirating everything, this is a significant hobby. That's why I scoff at price complaints. This product costs less than its competitor and the developers are vastly more responsive and involved in this community, in my experience. Emby is a bargain for this class of software. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdiesel 1114 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 (edited) I've noticed that many people don't associate software as something that is a product worth being paid for. Between all the great freeware programs out there, the OS coming bundled with your hardware, and the ability to pirate just about anything else there are people out there that have never paid for a piece of software in there life. I personally pay for very few programs or licenses because there is usually a free version, whether it be freeware or trial, that meets my needs but when the paid alternative is much better I have no problem paying for it, not to mention the fact you are paying for support too. On the flip side people have no problem dropping $100 on a Chinese Android box that will have out of date software in a year. I believe this is due to people's impression that physical items have value whereas non-physical items do not. Is the developers time not worth anything? Are the Bluray remuxes you pirate before the actual disk is even released not worth anything? How about the Abobe and Autodesk software suites you downloaded? It is one thing to disagree with the value of the software as nobody is forced to buy it but to continuously complain about it not being free proves nothing. The types of people willing to pay for software have likely already purchased Emby Premier and likely have zero regrets, the people who never pay for software would still be on here complaining if the cost was $30 and nothing other than free will make them happy. Now there may be a few people in fall someplace in between, primarily those who have purchased apps but not Premiere, and for those circumstances I believe that there should be no nag screen in purchased apps. I am not directing this at anyone specifically nor am I accusing everyone of be being a dirty pirate like myself but instead just a general rant of what I have observed about myself and others. Edited February 20, 2017 by Jdiesel 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest asrequested Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 I am not directing this at anyone specifically nor am I accusing everyone of be being a dirty pirate like myself but instead just a general rant of what I have observed about myself and others. Aaarrrrgh! Sorry, couldn't resist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
im85288 1493 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Well said @Jdiesal - ultimately it comes down to what people perceive as value for money. Personally I have both plex and emby lifetime licenses and have contributed to both projects in various capacities. As a developer I know how much time this takes and appreciate what I can use so feel it's worth every $/£ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cptlores 23 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 I have used Emby for a year or so but only just registered, because I wanted to went my frustration with the nag screens. This should be an indication of how the nag screen are perceived by average normal users outside this special interest bobble of lifetime premium membership users that are invested in the project. I selected Emby specifically because it covered all my needs for free. That was the decider. Had it not, or had the nag screen been there when I was looking I would have moved on. And this is the core of the problem. The nag have been back ported into what was already established free functionality. You can charge what every you want for premium features, but artificially limiting already established free functionality while legal is definitively not in the spirit of open-source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrincessClevage 173 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 (edited) Increase the price to $250 and remove all free offerings Edited February 20, 2017 by PrincessClevage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legallink 187 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 I'm just trying to think of other projects that offer free vs paid access. I use winrar, I paid for a license a long time ago, but didn't it have like a 30'secomd wait time to unzip a file? One that has no nag or related on the flip side is vlc. Just think vlc is a much lighter lift than emby, but at the same time a great product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIMan 0 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Winzip has that stupid timer. Needless to say -- don't use it/wont support it. I'm not sure what shape subsonic is in today, because I have moved on. But it used to have free/paid. Free was web interface. Paid was app access. That's reasonable, and I paid back then. Hell, even youtube just announced they are moving on from forced 30 second ads. And FWIW. Nobody is debating the sticker price. I smoked a brisket over the weekend valued at half an emby license. Big whoop. Fake news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest asrequested Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 What about the first 30 days after initial install to be nag free. Then start the wife, I mean nagging Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maegibbons 1267 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 I selected Emby specifically because it covered all my needs for free. That was the decider. Had it not, or had the nag screen been there when I was looking I would have moved on. And this is the core of the problem. You are right, this is the core of the problem. Users who want it all for free and do not want to pay or contribute are absolutely no use/help to this projects continuance. People who dont appreciate it and support it SHOULD move on rather than whining. Krs Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigzagtshirt 55 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Respectfully stating my opinion here: $99 for lifetime for this amazing software (plus being able to use the mobile apps at no extra charge) is a steal considering the amount of work the devs put into Emby, and the features it comes with. Not to mention all the troubleshooting the devs help with on the forum. Emby has been the single greatest addition to my media experience ever. Totally worth the $99 dollars, which is around the price of a good blu ray player. The best part about Emby to me is the fact that you can actually use it for free without any restriction at all (apart from the handful of special features that most people won't use anyway). So what if you have to look at a very short screen asking you to purchase? Reminds me of this: "Louis CK- Everything's Amazing and Nobody is Happy" Of course you'll probably need to watch a 15 second ad on YouTube first The irony... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathsquirrel 741 Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Emby has been the single greatest addition to my media experience ever. Totally worth the $99 dollars, which is around the price of a good blu ray player. I didn't HAVE a media collection before Media Browser. I had some DVDs which were a pain to store and browse, that's all. Without an Emby-style solution this hobby isn't usable IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cptlores 23 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) You are right, this is the core of the problem. Users who want it all for free and do not want to pay or contribute are absolutely no use/help to this projects continuance. People who dont appreciate it and support it SHOULD move on rather than whining. Krs Mark You do realize you are in the minority right? The normal approach to make a open-source project financially sound, is to build as big a user base as possible. The bigger and happier the the bulk user base is, the more users will be willing to pay for premium features. Making them angry and annoyed for sure will not be good for the project long term. And I don't have to look very hard to find an example of this. As I said, I have used Emby for a little more then a year now, and since I was happy with it when I started out, I bought the 1 year premium. Mostly to support a project I was happy with and found useful. But I never used any of the premium features and the price kept going up, so when the time came I let it expire. Needless to say I was not happy to discover how the free part had changed since I first started. And it definitively made getting a new premium membership out of the question on principle. Edited February 21, 2017 by cptlores 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceboy 2494 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 You do realize you are in the minority right? The normal approach to make a open-source project financially sound, is to build as big a user base as possible. The bigger and happier the the bulk user base is, the more users will be willing to pay for premium features. Making them angry and annoyed for sure will not be good for the project long term. And I don't have to look very hard to find an example of this. As I said, I have used Emby for a little more then a year now, and since I was happy with it when I started out, I bought the 1 year premium. Mostly to support a project I was happy with and found useful. But I never used any of the premium features and the price kept going up, so when the time came I let it expire. Needless to say I was not happy to discover how the free part had changed since I first started. And it definitively made getting a new premium membership out of the question on principle. so your example, which is supposed to bring us around to your way of thinking, is yourself? [emoji43] Look the Emby team have chosen this path. Now you choose yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceboy 2494 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 The funniest thing here is that cptlores and MIMan have a grand total of seven posts and 25 days on the forum between them 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breezytm 124 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) well.... not really. you said that you believed that as the project was open source then all users should be free to play back their media. but someone else already told you that you're wrong. open source does not mean free. users are free to play back their media. with vlc or similar. the project will not miss free loaders What I said is this: This is a free software with paid features option. Content playback, as far as I know, is not one of the premiere features." And yes I did bring in the open source to the conversation. Like others, I also gave my opinion on what I think is a suitable route that would make everyone happy. I will say this. If I purchased premiere for features, I honestly do not feel like I am getting my money's worth. I only use one or two of the premiere features and could care a whole lot less about the rest of them. Again, that's not to say they aren't useful. Just not useful to me. I did agree with someone on the thread that most of the features I feel should be premiere features are already given to the public for free. I will raise this again. I had that same argument with Plex devs a couple of years ago. Many users felt as if they were not getting their money's worth while many others disagree. Yes, as a Plexpass user you do get to beta test software before they are released to the public. You spent time testing and reporting bugs. Once it's all done and polished, the devs gave it to the public for free. People were raising concerns. Genuine concerns. How about they ask for a refund and wait until the software is free and use it just like the rest of the people who aren't paying for it. Plex team had to take that into consideration because after a long thread discussing this; even they had a hard time explaining to people why they should be a Plexpass member. People who spend money wants to feel special. Edited February 21, 2017 by breezytm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catsrules 17 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) Agree with deathsquirrel, the list proposed by catsrules is not really helpful. I mean no one watches the credits as it is! Is anyone going to even notice a reminder at the end? Emby knows when the movie is over based on the watch status. When you get 90% done or whatever you set it at. Pop up a message when you exit out of the movie with your in the 90% range. Or just any time you exit out of a movie. Edited February 21, 2017 by Catsrules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cptlores 23 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 The funniest thing here is that cptlores and MIMan have a grand total of seven posts and 25 days on the forum between them As I already said, you are in the minority. Most users of Emby will never join this forum, and when they start joining just to complain about some issue it means something is amiss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceboy 2494 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 As I already said, you are in the minority. Most users of Emby will never join this forum, and when they start joining just to complain about some issue it means something is amiss.And I'm sorry but the volume of non regular contributors to this thread doesn't support that argument. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overClocked! 63 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Increase the price to $250 and remove all free offerings Yikes. I dunno about that one... Does anyone remember a few years ago when LogMeIn discontinued their free remote access product and the total chaos that ensued? This pales in comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overClocked! 63 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 I have a couple of questions I want someone to confirm for me. I tested out playback of a handful of movies on a non-Premiere server (v 3.2.1) using the web client and I have yet to run across what the guys are calling a "nag" screen. I'm sure it will take time and several playbacks for this thing to appear, but the questions that have yet to be addressed in this thread are: 1. How frequently does this message appear? Is there a gradual progression or is it predictable? The OP mentioned that they have to wait "constantly" now for the timer to count down before they can play their media. 2. What exact information is presented in the message that is so appalling? 3. Does this message also appear within mobile or TV apps (Android, iOS, FireTV, etc.) that have been unlocked for playback without an Emby Premiere subscription? Can we examine it for a bit to see what's in the actual message? I don't get this screen yet, so thanks to @@shermanp for providing the screenshot. I'm married, so I'm a bit of an authority on what nagging is [emoji6]. This ain't it. It's gentle. It's informative. It calls attention to a great product (Emby Premiere) that has benefits far beyond what's listed in the example features. But it's obvious with the timer that the Emby team wants this information to be seen by non-Premiere users in hopes they will actually become customers. It is NOT begging for anything. It's NOT requiring a payment for you to continue. It does NOT prevent you from playing your media if you don't pay up. So there is no hard "pay wall" locking your own personal content as some have suggested. This issue isn't black and white. It's not fair to classify everyone using the product for free as "freeloaders". That's insulting. Some folks are truly evaluating the product to determine if a Premiere subscription is worth their hard earned money. So anything that muddies their experience can affect their decision. That is actually a thing. Of course, there are those that desire a completely unobstructed free experience. To those folks, this pop-up should be expected in one form or another. The practice has been in place for decades as evident in freeware and shareware products so I'm not sure why they are angry this was introduced. I suppose when you've gone so long without seeing a message of this kind in this product, to have it gradually pop up during your day, and to suddenly get a captive message with a timer can be a bit of a jolt. But it kind of goes with the territory with a free software as functional as this. For those that opted to "pay to play" on their device, it is my belief this captive screen should NOT be displayed on those respective apps. But is this even happening in any of the mobile apps? I'm not referring to when you complete an Android or iOS in-app, purchase and then use the Emby web client to playback instead. If you paid for playback on the Android platform, IT ONLY APPLIES TO THAT MOBILE APP, not Chrome or any other browser. You can't expect that to carry over to other clients. Only a Premiere license can do that. So hopefully someone can answer some of these questions with some degree of certainty so we can get a better understanding of all the pain and angst and upset feelings this has caused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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