Play Live TV Show right from Guide

[ebr 14958]

4 hours ago, paychi said:

If there could be setting for this in the app, it would be really great...

How would you get to that information screen?

[paychi 4]

I think that long pressing should bring up this play/record popup and just clicking should play it immediately. By default it could be as it is now, just please give us a chance to change it in the settings..

[ebr 14958]

Many people never discover long-press functions.  It is literally just one extra click though how it is now.  You don't even have to wait for anything to be read.  Just double-click and the channel plays...

[paychi 4]

Yes of course I'm talking this should be default that the popup opens by clicking, just give us the possibility to change this in settings please.. I have many friends with android boxes which don't have play buttons on remotes and all of them want to change this behaviour. It is really annoying that every time you want to just switch the channel you must perform this double clicking popup ritual

[Luke 37231]

Options are always possible in future updates. thanks for the feedback.

[ProMace67 4]

Hi, interesting topic. I can see the arguments from both sides. Personally, I'd say the current behavior is actually not the standard for DVB programs. I've been using DVBViewer (Server & Client) for many years and it simply works like this: you bring up either the guide or channel list, you browse through the list and it switches channels immediately when you select. Any additional info is always shown in a separate section on the screen, as is also the case with Emby, so to be honest the additional 'popup' screen feels redundant. Many TVs work in a similar fashion, My Samsung TV also immediately switches channels on select.

I tried Kodi as a DVBViewer client and although it works, playback is really dodgy (stutters etc). Emby is working very reliably from that perspective, the only thing I'm wishing for is to be able to control the GUI's behavior a bit more. Kodi actually has an option in the PVR & Live TV section to control what should happen on selection (in channel list as well as EPG), it would be really great if this feature could be included in Emby. So far I'm really content with the software, just looking for some to put on top of the ! 

Edited May 31, 2021 by ProMace67

[ebr 14958]

20 hours ago, ProMace67 said:

I've been using DVBViewer (Server & Client) for many years and it simply works like this: you bring up either the guide or channel list, you browse through the list and it switches channels immediately when you select. Any additional info is always shown in a separate section on the screen, as is also the case with Emby, so to be honest the additional 'popup' screen feels redundant. Many TVs work in a similar fashion, My Samsung TV also immediately switches channels on select.

But neither of those provide a recording option, correct...?

[ProMace67 4]

1 hour ago, ebr said:

But neither of those provide a recording option, correct...?

Recording is a separate option you can access based on context. Taking my Samsung as an example:

1. Current program on timeline:

a. Short press Select switches to channel.

b. Long press Select brings up Record option.

Note that any dedicated button could bring up a context menu, 'long press Select' is just how Samsung implemented it to eliminate the need for a separate button.

2. Future program on timeline:

- Press Select (long or short) brings up Record option.

So to answer your question: yes, they do provide a recording option. What the OP and I were / are looking for is behavior 1a for the Guide as well as the Channels section (where all entries listed are 'current', logically speaking).

To provide some more context, I've been experimenting a little with Ctrl-Shift-P (and Ctrl-P which effectively does the same in the given scenario):

1. In the Channels section, it works okay. Also, exiting a channel using Backspace brings me straight back to the location of the respective list entry. The latter makes sense because if you skipped the popup on your way in, you shouldn't be confronted with it on your way out.

2. In the Guide section, there appears to be an issue. Ctrl-Shift-P / Ctrl-P will give a 'No compatible streams are currently available' error, suggesting that the tuner is occupied. However, using Enter instead of Ctrl-Shift-P brings up the popup and another Enter plays the stream without issues. So it appears that the tuner is not being released in case of Ctrl-Shift-P / Ctrl-P. I assume this is a bug.

For your information, I'm using a TouchControl remote in combination with EventGhost and AutoHotkey, so of course it's possible to program Ctrl-Shift-P to kick off a channel, the issue is that it makes things unnecessarily complex. Because the behavior of Select (pushbutton in the middle of the navigation ring) now becomes context dependent: if you're either in the Guide or Channels section, Select should translate to Ctrl-Shift-P, otherwise to Enter. And since I can't keep track of the Emby context from within my scripts, it becomes a real PITA to keep the user interface intuitive (as is the case with the TV's OS and DVBViewer).

Long story short: it all comes down to options. Some people may want to have the intermediate popup, others (like the OP and myself) don't. Which is why I'd say a configuration option makes sense.

Edited May 31, 2021 by ProMace67

[ebr 14958]

1 hour ago, ProMace67 said:

so of course it's possible to program Ctrl-Shift-P to kick off a channel

A simple "Play" button command will do it as well.  Or, if you have a play button on the remote.

[ProMace67 4]

23 hours ago, ebr said:

A simple "Play" button command will do it as well.  Or, if you have a play button on the remote.

Yes, but that doesn't change the essence of what I'm trying to explain. The point is that it deviates from what I consider standard in the DVB/TV application world. If I want to switch to a channel, I press the Select/Enter/OK button inside the navigation ring. Not the Play button. The latter may make sense in the context of Movies, but it's not standard for Live TV. As said, it's not about the UI being 'right' or 'wrong', I'm just suggesting to provide an optionality in the GUI, the same way Kodi does, so people can choose for themselves.

[Carlo 4331]

How would you then setup a recording?
This is pretty much the standard for doing it with devices as unlike a cable company remote, we don't have a red record button but have to recycle the "ok/play" button for everything.  That means at a juncture point where a decision needs to be made it has to be made.  In this case, play or record.

if this user doesn't have record privileges then I could see defaulting to play.

Edited June 2, 2021 by cayars

[ProMace67 4]

1 hour ago, cayars said:

How would you then setup a recording?
This is pretty much the standard for doing it with devices as unlike a cable company remote, we don't have a red record button but have to recycle the "ok/play" button for everything.  That means at a juncture point where a decision needs to be made it has to be made.  In this case, play or record.

if this user doesn't have record privileges then I could see defauling to play.

I believe the option to record does not have to be implemented through a fixed dialog, which is currently forced upon everyone. Additionally, in my case I hardly ever want to record in the first place. I just want to browse and check out channels using a 'path of least resistance', exactly how TV manufacturers have implemented it, in the Channels and Guide section alike. I don't want to keep repeating myself, but it's about having options that can be enabled or disabled, depending on the device (and remote) you're working with as well as personal preference. I also mentioned how context matters, in particular in case of the Guide where behavior depends on whether a current or future program is selected.

[Carlo 4331]

But you're missing the point.  On a STB or TV you typically have both a record and play button which we don't have.  So how do we solve that issue?

[ProMace67 4]

Did you read my post about Samsung's (Tizen) implementation? No record or play button involved there whatsoever. As I explained the Samsung does produce a popup (conceptually the same as Emby's) but only if a future program is selected, which makes complete sense. Actually their approach is similar to what you're aiming for with 'limited' devices: do as much as possible with as few buttons as possible (Samsung Smart Remote).

[Carlo 4331]

Any chance you could snap a pic or two of how it's done on the Samsung?

[ProMace67 4]

Sorry for the late reply, it was bedtime here.  I'll provide some screenshots later on.

[ebr 14958]

16 hours ago, ProMace67 said:

Did you read my post about Samsung's (Tizen) implementation? No record or play button involved there whatsoever. As I explained the Samsung does produce a popup (conceptually the same as Emby's) but only if a future program is selected, which makes complete sense. Actually their approach is similar to what you're aiming for with 'limited' devices: do as much as possible with as few buttons as possible (Samsung Smart Remote).

We tried that during a beta cycle and the feedback was about 50:1 against so it never made it to release.  I imagine if we'd worked that way from the beginning, it would have been okay but changing it now will be tricky...

[paychi 4]

We don't want to change default behavior. We just want to have a possibility to change it in the settings..

[ProMace67 4]

16 hours ago, cayars said:

Any chance you could snap a pic or two of how it's done on the Samsung?

1: Comedy Central active, South Park, current program

2: Move down to Spike HD, All New Traffic Cops, current program

3: Select (short press) = switch to channel

4a: Bring up  Guide, move down to Discovery HD, Wheeler Dealers, current program

4b: Select (long press) = bring up context menu with options Record and View Details

5a: Bring up Guide, move right to Salvage Dawgs, future program

5b: Select (short press / long press) = bring up context menu with options Schedule Viewing, Schedule Recording and View Details.

6, 7, 8: Dialogs for the respective options mentioned under 5b.

As mentioned by ebr, I can imagine it wouldn't be wise to change out-of-the-box behavior, but this is why I referred to Kodi a couple of times as they have a clean configuration-based solution. So you can retain the existing Emby default, out-of-the-box behavior for everyone who needs it, while at the same time giving other people the option to deviate from that default.

[ebr 14958]

1 hour ago, paychi said:

We don't want to change default behavior. We just want to have a possibility to change it in the settings..

Unfortunately, that kind of a setting is just too granular/obscure.  If we had a setting for every similar behavior, there would be so many settings the program would be completely unmanageable - from both a usability and maintainability standpoint.  So, we need to just pick the best action for the most people in these cases.

[ProMace67 4]

1 hour ago, ebr said:

Unfortunately, that kind of a setting is just too granular/obscure.  If we had a setting for every similar behavior, there would be so many settings the program would be completely unmanageable - from both a usability and maintainability standpoint.  So, we need to just pick the best action for the most people in these cases.

I respectfully disagree. For one, IMO there is nothing obscure about the proposed setting. It obviously depends on phrasing as well. Second, what do you mean by 'every similar behavior'? There's a limited set of basic behaviors that the UI can exhibit in the context of browsing media, in this case TV channels. Third - and this is also a common practice - if it's really necessary, you can have a Basic and Expert mode for configuration settings and only expose less 'mainstream' settings in Expert mode.

[ProMace67 4]

On 6/2/2021 at 1:03 AM, cayars said:

Any chance you could snap a pic or two of how it's done on the Samsung?

It would have been nice if you at least would have responded to the feedback you asked me for. I can see that you upvoted ebr's reply so apparently you guys had your mind made up regardless. Sorry to say this, but it just doesn't come across as customer oriented behavior.

[Carlo 4331]

Sorry for the confusion but @ebrdid respond and is one of the key devs.

[ebr 14958]

5 hours ago, ProMace67 said:

Sorry to say this, but it just doesn't come across as customer oriented behavior.

Hi.  As I mentioned before, when we tried this out in beta most of our customers were against it.  I do think the context menu is a good method but changing a behavior that many of our users are already accustomed to gets us into trouble - even when it is a good change.

My previous response was specifically to making this behavior configurable.  We may ultimately decide to change the default.

[Luke 37231]

Apologies for the misunderstanding. We are looking at improving it. Thanks for the feedback.