Collaborative / Split Album Handling?

[nmkaufman 50]

I realize this has been touched on in the past, but I don't believe albums with multiple artists are being handled correctly.

I'm not talking about compilations or soundtracks. I mean albums that are collaborative efforts, attributed in full to two separate album artists.

This album is an example: https://musicbrainz.org/release/b0b30766-12b8-43c9-8d66-f0594e338f31

It's an album by both "Laura Mvula" with "Metropole Orkest" but Emby creates a new artist called "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" and attributes it only to them.

This is happening because the plain-text albumartist tag given by Musicbrainz is literally "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest"

The Musicbrainz Release Artist ID field is in the correct artist/artist format "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23" 

For these albums to be handled correctly, Emby should be giving the MusicBrainz ID fields priority over the plain text fields.

Edited July 9, 2021 by nmkaufman

[Happy2Play 9780]

A question would be why isn't Artist and Album Artist split like Artists?  To me Artist and Album Artist are improperly tagged.

[nmkaufman 50]

7 minutes ago, Happy2Play said:

A question would be why isn't Artist and Album Artist split like Artists?  To me Artist and Album Artist are improperly tagged.

I absolutely agree with you.

Maybe one of Musicbrainz's rules say the album artist has to be listed exactly how it appears on the album literature?

I stumbled across this thread: https://emby.media/community/index.php?/topic/75423-music-tagging-multiple-artists/

Where the user ginjaninja says they used to use a script to convert all joining words to forward slashes.

They also say it's no longer necessary after Emby 4.2, and that mbzid should have priority, so I don't understand why it's still not working.

 

 

Edited July 9, 2021 by nmkaufman

[Happy2Play 9780]

3 minutes ago, nmkaufman said:

They also say it's no longer after Emby 4.2, and that mbzid should have priority, so I don't understand why it's still not working.

4.6 was a complete rewrite of music so it is now 100% reliant on embedded tagging.  But @Lukewould have to comment on priority but believe priority is irrelevant as these fields are linked in the database to present everything except the Folder View tab.

So one Album Artists can not equal two MBZAlbumArtistids.

Edited July 9, 2021 by Happy2Play

[nmkaufman 50]

15 minutes ago, Happy2Play said:

So one Album Artists can not equal two MBZAlbumArtistids.

There's some discrepancies, though, because the individual songs are being attributed correctly to both artists.

So the artist mbzid is being respected, but the albumartist mbzid is being ignored, despite the plaintext fields being identical for both.

[Happy2Play 9780]

1 minute ago, nmkaufman said:

There's some discrepancies, though, because the individual songs are being attributed correctly to both artists.

Well they are reading the Artists tag for the track.  So that is is correct.  I believe Artist is ignored when Artists is populated.  

2 minutes ago, nmkaufman said:

So the artist mbzid is being respected, but the albumartist mbzid is being ignored, despite the plaintext fields being identical for both.

No it is broken as Album Artist "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" is not two items as showns in mbz "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23".  Album Artist is "Laura Mvula/Metropole Orkest" ie two items.

[nmkaufman 50]

5 minutes ago, Happy2Play said:

No it is broken as Album Artist "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" is not two items as showns in mbz "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23".  Album Artist is "Laura Mvula/Metropole Orkest" ie two items.

I get what you're saying. Plain text field shows one artist, mbzid shows two. Emby doesn't know what to do.

Evidently this is 'correct' by Musicbrainz standards, however, so the only solution is to give priority to the mbzid fields.

[Happy2Play 9780]

But those mbzids have to be linked to a name and Album Artist "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" will never be correct.

[Happy2Play 9780]

Album and Album Artist make the Album.  If mbzids are going to contradict the base fields, manual editing will be required.  But I guess future database expansion could possible accommodate different results.

[nmkaufman 50]

9 minutes ago, Happy2Play said:

Album and Album Artist make the Album.  If mbzids are going to contradict the base fields, manual editing will be required.  But I guess future database expansion could possible accommodate different results.

I would be interested to know what sort of script ginjaninja was using in that old thread, to manually fix these tags.

I wouldn't be opposed to doing it, myself, it just seems like a staggering chore.

Plus, there are situations like this: https://musicbrainz.org/artist/45716fc0-8e06-4143-a47b-327a7906ffb4

Which are the opposite problem, and can never be fixed from Emby's side.

[Happy2Play 9780]

Sonny & Cher would be another exception.  So the distinction of what is one and what is more then one has to be made.  But Album Artist "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" is not a exceptions as mbz make them two.

But mbz is deceiving to me also as they are ignoring "with" to give two artists.

 

[MBSki 1114]

10 hours ago, Happy2Play said:

Sonny & Cher would be another exception.  So the distinction of what is one and what is more then one has to be made.  But Album Artist "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" is not a exceptions as mbz make them two.

But mbz is deceiving to me also as they are ignoring "with" to give two artists.

In situations like this I always just set the first artist as the album artist, and then add both as artists (Laura Mvula;Metropole Orkest). Being able to do the same with album artists would be nice, but I don't think I've ever gotten Emby to recognize both album artists when trying that approach. It would be nice to have that option though.

[Luke 42078]

15 hours ago, nmkaufman said:

There's some discrepancies, though, because the individual songs are being attributed correctly to both artists.

So the artist mbzid is being respected, but the albumartist mbzid is being ignored, despite the plaintext fields being identical for both.

No, it's not ignored. The mbz ids are used to supplement with internet metadata, but the tagged albumartist names still need to be there as well. You only have one albumartist. If you want two of them, then it needs to be tagged as such with supported name separators.

Then the second mbzid will be attached to the second albumartist.

[Happy2Play 9780]

5 hours ago, mbarylski said:

In situations like this I always just set the first artist as the album artist, and then add both as artists (Laura Mvula;Metropole Orkest). Being able to do the same with album artists would be nice, but I don't think I've ever gotten Emby to recognize both album artists when trying that approach. It would be nice to have that option though.

You would split AA the same way.

[MBSki 1114]

30 minutes ago, Happy2Play said:

You would split AA the same way.

I thought the last time I tried it, it didn't work. I'll try it again though.

[nmkaufman 50]

1 hour ago, mbarylski said:

I thought the last time I tried it, it didn't work. I'll try it again though.

The album will only be listed as the first artist, but appears on both artists pages. 

It's still less than ideal if you only actually collect/care about 1 of the artist, and it ends up being listed as by the other.

[Happy2Play 9780]

Just now, nmkaufman said:

The album will only be listed as the first artist, but appears on both artists pages. 

It's still less than ideal if you only actually collect/care about 1 of the artist, and it ends up being listed as by the other.

Sorry I do not follow.

example 4 album artists and 4 artists.

[nmkaufman 50]

3 minutes ago, Happy2Play said:

Sorry I do not follow.

When you're browsing your albums in a list, it only displays the first artist.

[Happy2Play 9780]

1 minute ago, nmkaufman said:

When you're browsing your albums in a list, it only displays the first artist.

Can you elaborate?

Now looking at it from a Primary view there is a defect as it is only showing the first album artist. @Luke

[nmkaufman 50]

I've only ever used primary view to browse my music. Maybe I'll just switch.

[nmkaufman 50]

4 hours ago, Luke said:

No, it's not ignored. The mbz ids are used to supplement with internet metadata, but the tagged albumartist names still need to be there as well. You only have one albumartist. If you want two of them, then it needs to be tagged as such with supported name separators.

Then the second mbzid will be attached to the second albumartist.

We're just going in circles, because at the end of the day I just don't understand what's fundamentally different about the artists and albumartists fields.

Albumartist = "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest"; Musicbrainz Albumartist ID = "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23"

Artist = "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" ; Musicbrainz Artist ID = "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23"

All 4 fields are exactly the same, but emby is attributing songs to both artists, but the album only to one albumartist.

I suppose it is the way it is, and that's fine. The discrepancy just makes it seem like something that isn't working right, is why I created the thread.

[Happy2Play 9780]

7 minutes ago, nmkaufman said:

Albumartist = "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest"; Musicbrainz Albumartist ID = "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23"

The defect is in the metadata as "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" does not equal  "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23".

But "Laura Mvula/Metropole Orkest" does equal "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23"

9 minutes ago, nmkaufman said:

Artist = "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" ; Musicbrainz Artist ID = "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23"

Same as above.

But ARTISTS "Laura Mvula/Metropole Orkest" does equal Musicbrainz Artist ID = "37d067eb-495e-4888-ad97-4b5708ffd3a9/9f2ae371-63ad-496e-95ca-f90bad9b5b23"

One can never equal two so tagging has to match.

[nmkaufman 50]

7 minutes ago, Happy2Play said:

One can never equal two so tagging has to match.

Were still not getting anywhere, because my artist and album artist are identical. That's the part I don't understand.

Neither has the '/' beteween artists, but artist works and albumartist doesn't.

[Happy2Play 9780]

14 minutes ago, nmkaufman said:

because my artist and album artist are identical.

And they are technically wrong to Emby.  And splitting the does work as already shown above.

But give me a few to fined "Laura Mvula with Metropole Orkest" and post results.

[nmkaufman 50]

1 minute ago, Happy2Play said:

And they are technically wrong to Emby.  And splitting the does work as already shown above.

Yeah, I just don't understand why the songs (artist) work, and the albums (albumartist) don't; even when they both have the same problem.

The songs show both artists, individually. It's just the albums that don't.

I'm very appreciative of the help. I think the explanation is probably just technical, and I don't have a firm understanding of how the database actually works.