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Need advice on hardware requirements for 1080p transcoding.


Darkieth

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Darkieth

Hi! I'm thinking about upgrading my server hardware and I'm hoping someone can help me figure out what I need. I'd like the server to be able to transcode at minimum 1080p content, preferably at least two simultaneous streams as well as 1 direct play (shouldn't impact it, right?). I'm not sure if it matters but 90% of my files are x265 and most of the time they'll need to be transcoded for playback in browers. What kind of hardware would I need for this? My current setup is 4GB of ram and an AMD FX 6300 so I'm assuming I'll need a new build.

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Darkieth

Is the GPU responsible for transcoding? What role does the CPU play? Would it be sufficient to just add a GPU to my current setup or do I need to replace the CPU (and motherboard) too?

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iamspartacus

Is the GPU responsible for transcoding? What role does the CPU play? Would it be sufficient to just add a GPU to my current setup or do I need to replace the CPU (and motherboard) too?

 

Modern GPU's can handle all the video transcoding while the CPU will just be left with the audio transcoding (which usually doesn't take much resources).  

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lightsout

Is the GPU responsible for transcoding? What role does the CPU play? Would it be sufficient to just add a GPU to my current setup or do I need to replace the CPU (and motherboard) too?

Your best bet would be to grab a video card first and test it out. I use a 1050ti that I got used for $85. Nvidia has a two steam limitation on their consumer cards. Meaning you can only hardware accelerate two streams at a time with the graphics card. But there is a super easy drive mod that can bypass this.

 

Do know that this will require you to get Emby premium.

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  • 4 weeks later...
Darkieth

Bumping this as I have yet to pick up a GPU and the amd rx 570 (4GB) is on sale at the moment. Would this suffice or am I better off spending an additional $50 on the nvidia 1650?

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Do AMD cards work as well as Nvidia's for transcoding? Any limitations? 

 

Hi there, please check out our hardware acceleration wiki as it goes over what is supported on each platform that Emby Server runs on. Thanks !

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pmurphy0881

I will say that a GPU will probably be the quickest and fastest route, but modern day processors  (Ryzen, i7, etc...) can handle multiple x265 streams like it's nothing.  I do know that GPU's won't work for me simple due to the fact that there are those stream limits and AMD can be a bit finicky, but could be that I have an older model... Either way when I rebuilt my rig from and FX processor I did it with the Ryzen 7 1800X when it came out and I can and have handled multiple 1080p streams x265/HEVC encoded.  I can even handle a couple of 4K streams at a time too with little issue.

 

If you can get a GPU cheap then go that route if it meets your stream requirements, but knowing what you have under the hood from a CPU standpoint know that you may need to bump that and from my experience it was well worth it.

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  • 6 months later...
MyMediaAtHome

@@Sammy

 

Great!

I doubt it's going to work on my lowly GT 1030. It's good enough for Kodi which doesn't transcode. I think the GT 1030 can only decode and not encode. Or is that also unlocked with that patch?

 

I know so little of this stuff so I just going to ask... :-)

There are many, many cards. The prices vary a greatly. Cards have all sort of fancy specs. Different amounts of memory, different Clock speeds etc.

I know those things are of great importance for gamers; but what's important for Emby use?

Are the parts of the cards that Emby uses equally fast on all/most cards?

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lightsout

https://developer.nvidia.com/video-encode-decode-gpu-support-matrix

What columns need a 'Yes' to be used for Emby?

The ones with all boxes ticked are rather expensive.

Just look under GeForce. The ones that have the extra yes are the Turing cards. They added support for bframes. Honestly it's not a huge difference.

 

I got a used 1050ti for $85 and it works great. They all have a two stream limitation anyways without the driver hack. Pretty much all of them can do that. If you go 10 series the 1050ti or 1060 6gb are good choices.

 

People say that the 1650 is gimped. Reason being is it didn't get the upgraded encoder like the rest of the Turing cards. So it will run like a Pascal card. (10 series)

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MyMediaAtHome

Can you please expand a little on B frames. No need to go super techy.

The reason for the extra info is this. I'm a Kodi user that started with a GT710. Worked fine until the more 'heavy' videos became more common. So I bought a GT 1030.

Last week I checked out Plex. Not bad on itself but I hate it transcodes about everything. I greatly prefer the way Emby always tries Direct Play first.

Any Emby also transcodes in certain cases. And well, my GT 710 can only decode, not encode.

 

So when I buy yet another card I want to be more future proof. So I need to know the basics of what I'm missing by not having B frames support.

I must also add the CPU in my HTPC is lowly Pentium G4400. Good for Kodi because Kodi doesn't demand much processing power. But the HTPC now gets an extra task of running Emby.

So, if no B frame support means the CPU is going to be maxed out I might be better of buying a faster CPU that handles the transcoding?
 

I'm getting a bit tired of rebuilding every year. I had a nice small case for my GT 710. The GT 1030 takes a little more space so I had to buy a new case. But that only fit low profile cards. By the looks of it 'Emby compatible' cards don't come in low profile.  Then I'm even ignoring that those cards are power hungry and might max out my PSU.

 

Rant off @@lightsout thanks for your reply.

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lightsout

Can you please expand a little on B frames. No need to go super techy.

The reason for the extra info is this. I'm a Kodi user that started with a GT710. Worked fine until the more 'heavy' videos became more common. So I bought a GT 1030.

Last week I checked out Plex. Not bad on itself but I hate it transcodes about everything. I greatly prefer the way Emby always tries Direct Play first.

Any Emby also transcodes in certain cases. And well, my GT 710 can only decode, not encode.

 

So when I buy yet another card I want to be more future proof. So I need to know the basics of what I'm missing by not having B frames support.

I must also add the CPU in my HTPC is lowly Pentium G4400. Good for Kodi because Kodi doesn't demand much processing power. But the HTPC now gets an extra task of running Emby.

So, if no B frame support means the CPU is going to be maxed out I might be better of buying a faster CPU that handles the transcoding?

 

I'm getting a bit tired of rebuilding every year. I had a nice small case for my GT 710. The GT 1030 takes a little more space so I had to buy a new case. But that only fit low profile cards. By the looks of it 'Emby compatible' cards don't come in low profile.  Then I'm even ignoring that those cards are power hungry and might max out my PSU.

 

Rant off @@lightsout thanks for your reply.

Here is athread I found on reddit, I don't know all of the details here honestly.

 

b frames help with compression

  • I‑frames are the least compressible but don't require other video frames to decode.

  • P‑frames can use data from previous frames to decompress and are more compressible than I‑frames.

  • B‑frames can use both previous and forward frames for data reference to get the highest amount of data compression.

 

I am not sure that this is super relevant for emby, but more so for encoding with nvenc and something like ffmpeg or handbrake. (happy to be corrected here)

 

But to your question. in my opinion you will never notice a difference lacking b-frame support. The gpu will still handle the encoding just fine. I would recommend a GPU upgrade here.

 

The question is what do you need to do. Are you just wanting to transcode a couple 1080p streams? Because thats a piece of cake, get a used 1050ti and you'll be fine.

 

But if you want to future all you can do there is buy current hardware. Depends on your budget. To really future proof grab something like a 2060 super for $400. Totally unnecessary though.

 

A good choice may be a 1660. It has the most recent NVENC chip/encoder, you can get a Bstock card (1 yr warranty) currently from EVGA for $200.

https://www.evga.com/products/productlist.aspx?type=8

 

But here is a chart that will probably help you answer whatever question you may have. Just know that this chart is using the hacked driver, (which is a piece of cake and totally worth doing.)  As all RTX and GTX have a driver forced two stream limitation.

 

According to this chart the 1660 can transcode 20 1080p to 720p streams.

https://www.elpamsoft.com/?p=Plex-Hardware-Transcoding

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MyMediaAtHome

I don't expect that many streams. And to what they are transcoded is partly decided on by Emby I guess.

I only have 3Mbyte upstream, so a card that can handle many streams is just moving the bottleneck to my internet connection. And as for right now, no fiber available where I live.

 

The  GTX 1050 comes in low profile, and even has HDMI out which seems to be getting rare with the newer cards.

 

To contradict myself... I want future proof but not at all cost. Say I can pick a $100 card and a future proof $400 card. The $100 card works fine for a year and in that time the $400 card dropped to $250. 

 

That last link needs a lot of study. A loooot of new things in there for me.

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lightsout

I don't expect that many streams. And to what they are transcoded is partly decided on by Emby I guess.

I only have 3Mbyte upstream, so a card that can handle many streams is just moving the bottleneck to my internet connection. And as for right now, no fiber available where I live.

 

The GTX 1050 comes in low profile, and even has HDMI out which seems to be getting rare with the newer cards.

 

To contradict myself... I want future proof but not at all cost. Say I can pick a $100 card and a future proof $400 card. The $100 card works fine for a year and in that time the $400 card dropped to $250.

 

That last link needs a lot of study. A loooot of new things in there for me.

Basically with that link uncheck "show all", then select the GPU you are considering and you can see the amount of streams it can do.

 

I usually hear people say avoid the 1050 because of its low ram. Your mileage may vary but I would personally go to eBay and find a 1050ti used. Should be pretty cheap. Good luck

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MyMediaAtHome

Yeah, the GTX 1050 Ti goes to 4GB max. I would say that's plenty until recently. There are evn 32GB cards....

The GTX 1660 goes up to 6GB.

Where I looked the cards with the most memory in their series are the cheapest. So that's a no brainer.

 

Found some great deals on Ebay (if I win the auction). Thanks for the tip!

Now I have to figure out if GBs are more or less important than a later generation card. Like 1660-6GB vs 1080-8GB

Edited by MyMediaAtHome
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lightsout

Yeah, the GTX 1050 Ti goes to 4GB max. I would say that's plenty until recently. There are evn 32GB cards....

The GTX 1660 goes up to 6GB.

Where I looked the cards with the most memory in their series are the cheapest. So that's a no brainer.

 

Found some great deals on Ebay (if I win the auction). Thanks for the tip!

Now I have to figure out if GBs are more or less important than a later generation card. Like 1660-6GB vs 1080-8GB

I think for this usage once we're talking 6gb you looking pretty good. I would personally rather have the 1660 for the upgraded encoding cup. Smaller card, less heat, less power. That's just my .02.

 

If you look at the 1660 on those charts I linked you can do quite a few transcodes.

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MyMediaAtHome

Your .02 are very valued :-)

 

Found a 1660 Ti 6GB for $308.

And a complete Gaming PC for $330

Specs of that PC

  • GTX 1660 'regular' 6GB
  • Ryzen 5 2400G - 3.6GHz
  • 8GB memory.
  • And all the other stuff like tower case, PSU, Windows, mouse, keyboard and HDD of unknown capacity.

Another Gaming PC that's a bit pricey. $550

  • GTX 1660 Ti 6GB
  • i5 4460
  • 16GB memory
  • Case, Windows, PSU and 1TB HDD

 

I wasn't really looking for a complete build, but perhaps a fat GPU isn't a good match for a Pentium G4400.

 

But the main thing is still good transcoding so I have to figure out the Ti is really worth it for that use. https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2019/03/15/nvidia-gtx-1660-vs-1660-ti/

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lightsout

$330 seems pretty cheap for that first setup. I world assume everything is going to be generic. ie, cheapest model of that GPU, bottom of the line Mobo and power supply. One stick of slow ram.

 

For Htpc/server use it probably wouldn't matter.

 

I don't think you will see any difference getting the 1660ti for Emby. Are you gaming with this machine?

 

I world not at all recommend that second system. A 4 core 4 thread CPU in 2019 is not worth it. That's a very old CPU/platform.

 

If this is just for Emby, just adding a gpu should help a lot. If you also want better CPU performance you could just replace your current Pentium.

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MyMediaAtHome

$330 seems pretty cheap for that first setup. I world assume everything is going to be generic. ie, cheapest model of that GPU, bottom of the line Mobo and power supply. One stick of slow ram.

 

For Htpc/server use it probably wouldn't matter.

 

I don't think you will see any difference getting the 1660ti for Emby. Are you gaming with this machine?

 

I world not at all recommend that second system. A 4 core 4 thread CPU in 2019 is not worth it. That's a very old CPU/platform.

 

If this is just for Emby, just adding a gpu should help a lot. If you also want better CPU performance you could just replace your current Pentium.

 

I can't really comment on the slow ram. But if must guess I'd say not slow. It's a gamer PC with led strips on the case. A dragon on the case and mouse. Surely that's not proof of anything... The advertizer states it runs all games on medium.

This machine is a dedicated HTPC/server. My TV is connected to it, at that's it.

 

I've been looking around and finding a GPU like that under $330 isn't that easy, unless I can have one with a lowball offer at an action. Combined with a CPU, I doubt below $330 is possible. Not needed right now, but the 1TB extra storage is nice too. The  1660 uses 120W. The PSU in my HTTP is only 200W.

 

I'm really considering  pulling the trigger on the $330 PC

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