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Newbie Needing Help


DLD

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Hi,

 

I am new to FreeNAS and new to Emby. After installing FreeNAS I copied all of my media over to it. I then installed the Emby plugin and think I followed the various YouTube videos on how to get the Emby plugin to see the dataset where the videos are stored. This seemed to work in so far as, when I created the library and selected TV Shows, Emby seemed to display the file location of where the videos reside. I then told Emby to scan the library but nothing appeared in the library.

 

The structure of the file system has top level folders called Film and TV. Under TV I have sub-folders of Documentaries, Drama etc. Under these I have a directory for each show.

 

All of the files are .TS files and I thought maybe Emby could not read those, so I converted one file to ,MP4 but Emby still does not seem to find it.

 

What am I doing wrong?

 

Also, Emby only seems to have fixed categories of TV, Movies etc. I buy various videos that don't fit into any of the Emby categories. For example, I have a large number of training videos on various topics. I would like to create a category for those and then have sub-folders (sub-catagories) for these based on the type of training. Can Emby do this?

 

Thanks,

 

DLD

 

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PhilWhite

Hi,

 

Luke would better answer this, but your file structure might be an issue.  It is actually easier to set this up with all of your TV under one big directory, but you can do it with what you have.

 

What Emby wants to see is not a directory/folder but your actual files.

 

So, for TV you can set up several TV sections and then label them not as TV but as TV Documentary, TV Drama, etc.  The "TV" section is important primarily for where to look for metadata.  So, for all of your TV subfolders you would want to use the TV section, but just label them to suit your needs for what is actually in that subfolder.

 

To do so, for your TV shows, click on TV and the for documentaries, click down the tree structure past the TV super-directory to documentaries and click on that directory.  You will want to see the actual files in the documentary directory.  Once you have hit that level it will add all of them to your library.  You will need to label it "TV Documentaries" or "Documentaries" so that you will know where to look for them in Emby.

 

Do the same for dramas and whatever other sections you have.

 

The other way to do it is to simply have one section for all of TV (and movies and music).  The metadata will know what is a documentary and what is a drama and will place them in their proper genre (well, mistakes are always a possible issue, but they are easy to sort out afterwards).  But that would require restructuring your files.

 

 

ETA:  By the way, if you used the plugin, and if you are using Freenas 11.2, you might run into problems playing movies if the Emby version is still on 3.5.2 or 3.5.3.  It is a compatibility issue between that version of Freenas and the ffmpeg file in that version of Emby.  There is a newer version of Emby that works very well with Freenas 11.2.  We can walk you through the setup process.  It requires using the command line in Freenas, but it isn't as hard as you might think.  There is a thread outlining what to do, but there are some tricks about the best way to go about it (or what worked for me).

 

For the instructional videos, there are two options.  One is to check with where the metadata might be held -- for movies the main source is TMDB (the movie database) and for TV it is TVDB (the TV database).  You can search for each of those videos on those sites and see if anyone has added them.  If so, just use whichever 'scraper' (either TMDB or TVDB) has the data for your video.  I think TV will search for metadata in both TVDB and TMDB, though, so it might be a good option for a general approach, and just label the section "Instructional" or whatever you want.

 

If you don't care about the metadata (basically just a way to make it look pretty), then when you want to add a section for them, click on 'add media library' (in library section) and choose 'mixed media' (should be the last option) and label that section however you would like (ex. "Instructional Videos").  Then to add the videos, click through your 'tree' to where those videos are -- so, for example, possibly, /media/Movies/Instructional (or however you have them labelled and under whichever path).

 

I hope that make sense.

Edited by PhilWhite
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Thanks for your reply.

 

I thought the directory structure might be the issue so I copied one file to the top of the Film folder and it didn't seem to make any difference. Is there a document that says how to structure the files? Does the Film folder need to be called Movies?

 

I am using FreeNAS 11.2 and Emby 3.5.3.0. Is there a forum post telling me what I need to do?

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PhilWhite

Thanks for your reply.

 

I thought the directory structure might be the issue so I copied one file to the top of the Film folder and it didn't seem to make any difference. Is there a document that says how to structure the files? Does the Film folder need to be called Movies?

 

I am using FreeNAS 11.2 and Emby 3.5.3.0. Is there a forum post telling me what I need to do?

 

 

Hmm, not sure what the issue is since that should have worked.  Using .ts files shouldn't pose any problems either.

 

One option to try would be to destroy the plugin and restart using the instructions in this thread:  https://emby.media/community/index.php?/topic/60971-new-freenas-package-for-testing/

 

But let me look at something first and get back to you.  You might be able to just use your existing jail and update emby from there.

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PhilWhite

Quick question before starting:  what do you have listed as your mount points in your jail?  The source should be where you have all your media stored.  The destination should usually end with /media for most uses.

 

So, the source should be something along the lines of /mnt/(Your Volume)/(Your dataset for media)

 

And the destination should be something along the lines of /mnt/iocage/jails/emby/root/media. 

 

 

ETA:  OK, doesn't look like you can use the process for updating in that linked thread for jails created using the standard Freenas plugin route.

 

So, one option is to start over and use the process that Luke outlines in the first post of that linked thread.  You will want to destroy your old jail -- do that by deleting the plugin.  Don't worry, it will not do anything to your data.

 

I would use Marakai's repo instead since it seems to work better.  The instructions for doing that can be found in post #44 and better in post #367.  I will give you the easiest one to use from the latter post, if you don't care what your ip address will be for the emby server.

 

The main instructions are, open a shell in Freenas (next to the last option on the left), then type in exactly:

 

wget https://raw.githubusercontent.com/bott0r/iocage-plugin-emby/beta/emby-server-beta.json

iocage fetch -P dhcp=on vnet=on bpf=yes allow_raw_sockets=1 -n emby-server.json --branch 'beta'

 

Marakai puts his jail in a temporary folder, hence the cd /tmp command in his post, but that isn't absolutely necessary.

 

This will give you a jail that you can configure in the Freenas GUI and an emby server that you can also access like a regular plugin in the GUI.  The emby version will be 3.6.0.83 which is latest beta.  Don't be concerned about it being a beta version -- this will overcome a problem that arises trying to use Freenas 11.2 with earlier version of Emby.

 

The process takes a while and there is no nice box telling you the progress, so be patient with it.  You will probably get an error message during the build process telling you that 'master' may not work, but it will blow past it and still create your jail and a new Emby server.  You will end up with a jail called 'emby-server'.

 

Looks hard, but it is actually easier than it looks.  You will have to set up the mount points for the jail once it is created -- to do that you click on the jail (make sure you are in the jail section and not the plugin section), stop it, and scroll to the far right where you will see three dots.  Click on the three dots and click on "mount points".  and then click on the Actions button up above.  Click "Add a mount point", then follow what I wrote above to add the mounts -- the exact location depends on where you have your media stored. 

 

For the destination, click on the folder icon for destination and it will load the first part (/mnt/iocage/jails/emby (or emby-server)/root, then you scroll down and find media and click on that folder -- it should add /media to the path.

 

Once the mount points are set up for the jail, restart the jail; you can then access your server the usual way -- either type in the address for page http://ip address:8096 or go to the plugin section, click on the emby server, scroll to the far right, click on the three dots and click manage.  That should take you to the setup process where you can add libraries, etc.

 

It's a little bit of work, but it will work.  Luke is feverishly working on setting up a future easy solution for updates.

Edited by PhilWhite
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Before I answer your question I should point out something that is kind of strange about my set-up in comparison with all the videos/examples that I see. In everything I see there is /mnt/iocage. On my system I see /mnt/(my volume)/iocage. I don't know why the difference? 

 

I have two USB flash drives for the boot drives and 5 x 4TB disks. When I set up the system I just took what FreeNAS recommended for the use of the disks and I don't know if I got something wrong.

 

When I installed the Emby Jail it wanted a pool to store it and there was only the one pool available. Is that the source of my problems?

 

 

In answer to your question. The source is /mnt/Leo100_Data_Pool/Video and the destination is /mnt/Leo100_Data_Pool/iocage/jails/emby/root/media

 

 

I just restarted the Emby Jail and it has now decided that I have one film and that it is season 36. I'm not sure what that is as Emby won't play it but I did copy an MP4 into the top level of the /mnt/Leo100_Data_Pool/Video/Film folder. It hasn't found anything else.

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PhilWhite

I think you are ok with your set up.  I probably should have just suggested restarting the jail to begin with.  I think now you have the issue of it seeing the only file you have made available -- the one that is in the Films directory and not in a subdirectory.  Emby can't read through your subdirectories.  You have to direct it to the files.

 

The reason it won't play that file is that there is a problem with ffmpeg versions with the 'older' Emby versions and using Freenas 11.2 (it's not a problem with earlier versions of Freenas, but I wouldn't go back).  There is a thread detailing the work around for getting a workable ffmpeg, but I'm not sure that works with 11.2 STABLE (I couldn't get it to work).  And it's a bit of a pain compared to recreating the jail and emby server from scratch.

 

There is a way of checking if this is the case if you have an android phone.  You can add Emby to your phone and see if it can play that file.  But that won't solve the ffmpeg issue for every other player.

 

The easiest thing, I think, at this point would be to destroy the plugin and try creating the jail and emby-server using Luke's method and Marakai's repo.  It really just amounts to starting a shell session, typing in the lines in the previous post, and waiting a long time for it all to finish.  I haven't actually used the commands Marakai offered in post 367 of that thread, but he has been spot on with all other suggestions.  If you haven't used the shell before, type in the first line starting with wget... then hit enter.  Let it do it's thing and when you see the prompt again type in the second line and hit enter.  

 

I took the longer route of creating the jail and server from post #44 and then updating to the latest beta version.  Partially that is because I do care what ip address Emby uses.

 

If you decide to go this route, just make sure that you drill down to the level where you see your actual files when you set up your libraries.  The way you have it set up you will have to create more libraries, but that is not a problem.  So, instead of a single TV library, you will have to have TV Documentary and TV Drama, etc.  I assume the same will be true of your movie sections too.

 

The other option, if you have smb shares set up would be to go in and move all your TV files to a TV folder and movies to one Movie folder (name doesn't matter).  But that really isn't necessary if you are not bothered by having several TV libraries, etc.

Edited by PhilWhite
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I found out why I was seeing a series 36. The system was running a little slow and I selected a folder that I did not mean to select.

 

But it seems as if Emby will not read sub-folders within the library unless there is an option somewhere to do this? And it will not let me add a folder to the library that is one level down, again, unless there is an option to let me do this?

 

So, with my structure it will let me add /media/film but it ignores all folders under /media/film. Under /media/film I have a folder "Bridge of Spies" but it ignores that folder and also won't let me add it to the library.

 

I had assumed that I could record a TV series and just copy it to a new folder and Emby would monitor all the sub-folders, see the files and add them to the library. But it looks like it wants me to add the folder to the library every time I add a new series and that the folder can only be directly under /media? Is that correct? If it is that seems really strange as Emby is making me do work just because it will not go further levels down. 

 

I have always structured my music collection in a similar way to what I have done with the TV Shows and I've never come across a music program that will not scan the entire structure. What am I missing here?

 

 

It doesn't really matter to me if the video will not play in Emby as long as it plays in Kodi. However, when I play the series 36 file in Kodi on my PC using the Emby add-on I see some flickering. If I play that file directly in Kodi there is no flickering. Am I doing something wrong?

It doesn't really matter to me if the video will not play in Emby as long as it plays in Kodi.

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PhilWhite

Actually, one thing above is incorrect.  When I said drill down to the 'file level' that should really read drill down to the 'title level' since that is what it is looking for -- titles.  So, if your movies are in folders correctly titled -- like "Blade Runner (1982)" and it has a file in it labelled Blade Runner (1982).mp4 (or .mkv or .ts, or whatever) it will see the mp4 file in the Blade Runner folder.

 

Or for TV you can have all the shows for a series labelled the name of that series and have subfolders for different seasons and that is also not a problem.

 

For music you don't have to drill down to the album level since it works off artists, so if you have several albums from one artist under that artists name in a big folder it will have no problem with that.

 

But If you have a Movies folder and have subfolders labelled Drama, Comedy, etc.  and you only open to the point where you see the subfolders for Drama, Comedy, etc. I don't think it can 'see' the titles you have in those subfolders.

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PhilWhite

I found out why I was seeing a series 36. The system was running a little slow and I selected a folder that I did not mean to select.

 

But it seems as if Emby will not read sub-folders within the library unless there is an option somewhere to do this? And it will not let me add a folder to the library that is one level down, again, unless there is an option to let me do this?

 

So, with my structure it will let me add /media/film but it ignores all folders under /media/film. Under /media/film I have a folder "Bridge of Spies" but it ignores that folder and also won't let me add it to the library.

 

I had assumed that I could record a TV series and just copy it to a new folder and Emby would monitor all the sub-folders, see the files and add them to the library. But it looks like it wants me to add the folder to the library every time I add a new series and that the folder can only be directly under /media? Is that correct? If it is that seems really strange as Emby is making me do work just because it will not go further levels down. 

 

I have always structured my music collection in a similar way to what I have done with the TV Shows and I've never come across a music program that will not scan the entire structure. What am I missing here?

 

 

It doesn't really matter to me if the video will not play in Emby as long as it plays in Kodi. However, when I play the series 36 file in Kodi on my PC using the Emby add-on I see some flickering. If I play that file directly in Kodi there is no flickering. Am I doing something wrong?

It doesn't really matter to me if the video will not play in Emby as long as it plays in Kodi.

It should see "Bridge of Spies" if you have it directed to /media/Films and "Bridge of Spies" is in the Film folder.  I think it will even do so if you don't have a working .ts or .mp4 file labelled "Bridge of Spies" in that folder.

 

There is also an issue with getting metadata in Freenas if you don't use vnet.  I don't think the plugin uses vnet (it asks which interface you want to use if you don't click dhcp and vnet is not one of the choices).  I couldn't get it to load metadata for my music artists until I quit using the plugin and created my own jail and added Emby to it.

 

By "Emby addon" do you mean Emby for Kodi?  I haven't used that in a long time, so I can't really answer the question.

 

I'm also not sure if you need to make a change in tunables.  When iocage was first used in Freenas we all had to add lines to the tunables section to bridge from the primary interface to vnet.  That change moved over in the update, so that might potentially be an issue?

 

The plugin isn't really ready for prime time yet.

Edited by PhilWhite
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PhilWhite

I found out why I was seeing a series 36. The system was running a little slow and I selected a folder that I did not mean to select.

 

But it seems as if Emby will not read sub-folders within the library unless there is an option somewhere to do this? And it will not let me add a folder to the library that is one level down, again, unless there is an option to let me do this?

 

So, with my structure it will let me add /media/film but it ignores all folders under /media/film. Under /media/film I have a folder "Bridge of Spies" but it ignores that folder and also won't let me add it to the library.

 

I had assumed that I could record a TV series and just copy it to a new folder and Emby would monitor all the sub-folders, see the files and add them to the library. But it looks like it wants me to add the folder to the library every time I add a new series and that the folder can only be directly under /media? Is that correct? If it is that seems really strange as Emby is making me do work just because it will not go further levels down. 

 

I have always structured my music collection in a similar way to what I have done with the TV Shows and I've never come across a music program that will not scan the entire structure. What am I missing here?

 

 

It doesn't really matter to me if the video will not play in Emby as long as it plays in Kodi. However, when I play the series 36 file in Kodi on my PC using the Emby add-on I see some flickering. If I play that file directly in Kodi there is no flickering. Am I doing something wrong?

It doesn't really matter to me if the video will not play in Emby as long as it plays in Kodi.

 

 

Good, Luke is here.  He will be able to figure it out.

 

I'm beginning to think that the problem is specific to the plugin and trying to use it with Freenas 11.2.  Much of this may boil down to the interface being used since there is a known problem getting metadata when not using vnet with the later versions of Freenas.

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Not sure the best way of showing the folder structure but here is a portion of the section under /media/Film and then the section for each of those films. The rest of the films are the same structure and so are the TV programs. All are .TS files as you can see. I couldn't work out who the owner/group should be so I made them emby as I thought that would eliminate that as an issue. None of these show up in the library so I guess I have done something stupid somewhere. 

 

drwxrwxr-x+ 2 emby   emby          3 Dec 12 23:27 Before I Go To Sleep

drwxrwxr-x+ 2 emby   emby          3 Dec 13 17:16 Bridge of Spies

drwxrwxr-x+ 2 emby   emby          3 Dec 13 16:41 Drive

 



Film/Before I Go To Sleep:

total 5557989

-rwxrwxr-x+ 1 emby  emby  5694764400 Dec 12 22:46 Before I Go To Sleep.ts

 

Film/Bridge of Spies:

total 8649860

-rwxrwxr-x+ 1 emby  emby  8862152116 Dec 12 23:32 Bridge Of Spies.ts

 

Film/Drive:

total 2097646

-rwxrwxr-x+ 1 emby  emby  2149186108 Dec 12 23:39 Drive.ts

 


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Okay something weird has just happened. I stopped the plug-in and restarted it, then did a library search. Nothing appeared but under the my media heading was a section that said

 

Discover Emby Premiere

Enjoy Emby DVR, get free access to Emby apps, and more.
 
The weird bit is that below that is an advert for Drive which is one of the movies in the list. Maybe just random or maybe it has read the movie info?
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PhilWhite

 

Not sure the best way of showing the folder structure but here is a portion of the section under /media/Film and then the section for each of those films. The rest of the films are the same structure and so are the TV programs. All are .TS files as you can see. I couldn't work out who the owner/group should be so I made them emby as I thought that would eliminate that as an issue. None of these show up in the library so I guess I have done something stupid somewhere. 
 
drwxrwxr-x+ 2 emby   emby          3 Dec 12 23:27 Before I Go To Sleep
drwxrwxr-x+ 2 emby   emby          3 Dec 13 17:16 Bridge of Spies
drwxrwxr-x+ 2 emby   emby          3 Dec 13 16:41 Drive
 
Film/Before I Go To Sleep:
total 5557989
-rwxrwxr-x+ 1 emby  emby  5694764400 Dec 12 22:46 Before I Go To Sleep.ts
 
Film/Bridge of Spies:
total 8649860
-rwxrwxr-x+ 1 emby  emby  8862152116 Dec 12 23:32 Bridge Of Spies.ts
 
Film/Drive:
total 2097646
-rwxrwxr-x+ 1 emby  emby  2149186108 Dec 12 23:39 Drive.ts
 

 

Did you change the emby service user to emby?

 

Not sure if this will help; Marakai or Luke will be better at this, but Marakai's instructions:

 

iocage console emby-server

service emby-server onestop

pw groupmod emby -n emby -g 1000

pw usermod emby -n emby -u 1000 -g 1000

chown -R emby:emby /var/db/emby-server

sysrc 'emby_server_user=emby'

service emby-server onestart

 

You don't have to use onestop or onestart.  A simple stop and start command work fine.  And since you are using the plugin, I think the jail is called emby, so the first command should be: iocage console emby  (or whatever your jail name is)

 

All using shell.

 

What that does is create a user named emby in group emby if you haven't done so already.  You need that since your owner is named emby.  And then it sets user emby as the emby server user.  Otherwise I think Freenas defaults to root as the user.  If you already have a user and group named emby (in the user section of Freenas), then you can skip the usermod and groupmod steps.

 

In other words, this may just be a permissions issue.

Edited by PhilWhite
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I would need to see more detail in regards to folder structure, but what i can say is that there are a lot of improvements in this area in the upcoming 3.6 release. I don't think you'll have this issue anymore. Thanks.

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I would need to see more detail in regards to folder structure, but what i can say is that there are a lot of improvements in this area in the upcoming 3.6 release. I don't think you'll have this issue anymore. Thanks.

 

What more detail do you want? I have one pool with a dataset called Video in it. Under that sits directly Film and TV. The file structure under those is as I listed above but with many more files.

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Did you change the emby service user to emby?

 

Not sure if this will help; Marakai or Luke will be better at this, but Marakai's instructions:

 

iocage console emby-server

service emby-server onestop

pw groupmod emby -n emby -g 1000

pw usermod emby -n emby -u 1000 -g 1000

chown -R emby:emby /var/db/emby-server

sysrc 'emby_server_user=emby'

service emby-server onestart

 

You don't have to use onestop or onestart.  A simple stop and start command work fine.  And since you are using the plugin, I think the jail is called emby, so the first command should be: iocage console emby  (or whatever your jail name is)

 

All using shell.

 

What that does is create a user named emby in group emby if you haven't done so already.  You need that since your owner is named emby.  And then it sets user emby as the emby server user.  Otherwise I think Freenas defaults to root as the user.  If you already have a user and group named emby (in the user section of Freenas), then you can skip the usermod and groupmod steps.

 

In other words, this may just be a permissions issue.

 

I thought it might be a permissions issue which is why I tried changing the ownership of the .TS files to be emby. But I'm confused by the commands. I assume that iocage console emby-server takes me to inside the jail. Am I then creating an emby user inside the jail? If yes, does this have to be the same as the emby user outside the jail in terms of uid etc? 

 

I should point out that I have quite a bit of experience with Unix but it was a very long time ago so I am VERY VERY rusty! So I might well have done something really stupid that others would not have done.

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PhilWhite

I thought it might be a permissions issue which is why I tried changing the ownership of the .TS files to be emby. But I'm confused by the commands. I assume that iocage console emby-server takes me to inside the jail. Am I then creating an emby user inside the jail? If yes, does this have to be the same as the emby user outside the jail in terms of uid etc? 

 

I should point out that I have quite a bit of experience with Unix but it was a very long time ago so I am VERY VERY rusty! So I might well have done something really stupid that others would not have done.

Yes, iocage console (jailname) gets you into the jail

 

If you have an emby user outside the jail then I would assume that it should be available inside the jail.  But yes, the uid should match since that is the owner of your media.  Adjust your commands accordingly.

 

If you are experienced with Unix this should be pretty easy.  It's probably worth trying to make the emby user you created in Freenas match the one in your jail and give it control over the emby server and see if it works.

 

ETA: and by easy, I mean -- good, you won't be scared of using the command line

 

ETA: And I forgot to address the stuttering issue you mentioned.  My guess is that Emby is transcoding the .ts file.  Kodi plays .ts files natively.  How much RAM doe you have in your freenas box?

Edited by PhilWhite
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PhilWhite

One other possible issue -- did you change permissions on your dataset?  I seem to recall that might produce problems, at least with earlier versions of Freenas.  Someone with more Freenas experience would be better to answer that issue, though.

 

But that might have only been a problem with the old warden jails.  I don't know the answer to that.

Edited by PhilWhite
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What content type is the library created with?

 

The Film library was created with Movies content type (if that is the right name) and the TV library with the TV Shows content type, again if that is the right name.

 

I decided to delete the jail and start again but then something on another computer crashed and I had to look at that.

 

What is really strange is that the only content that Emby found was a video located in a folder at the top of the Video dataset. There are other videos also in other folders in the same location and Emby did not find them. I thought this might be due to permissions but the permissions are actually all the same. The only difference is that the video that Emby found was located in a sub-folder called "Season 36".

 

Could it be that Emby is looking for all the video files to be located in folders called Season x?

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Yes, iocage console (jailname) gets you into the jail

 

If you have an emby user outside the jail then I would assume that it should be available inside the jail.  But yes, the uid should match since that is the owner of your media.  Adjust your commands accordingly.

 

If you are experienced with Unix this should be pretty easy.  It's probably worth trying to make the emby user you created in Freenas match the one in your jail and give it control over the emby server and see if it works.

 

ETA: and by easy, I mean -- good, you won't be scared of using the command line

 

ETA: And I forgot to address the stuttering issue you mentioned.  My guess is that Emby is transcoding the .ts file.  Kodi plays .ts files natively.  How much RAM doe you have in your freenas box?

 

 

I decided to delete the jail and start again but I really don't quite understand which user/group should own the files and what the relationship is regarding users/groups within the jail/outside the jail.

 

The box has 16GB of ram but I had assumed that given Kodi could play the files without transcoding, that Emby would just send them as is. Is there a way to tell it not to transcode?

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The Film library was created with Movies content type (if that is the right name) and the TV library with the TV Shows content type, again if that is the right name.

 

I decided to delete the jail and start again but then something on another computer crashed and I had to look at that.

 

What is really strange is that the only content that Emby found was a video located in a folder at the top of the Video dataset. There are other videos also in other folders in the same location and Emby did not find them. I thought this might be due to permissions but the permissions are actually all the same. The only difference is that the video that Emby found was located in a sub-folder called "Season 36".

 

Could it be that Emby is looking for all the video files to be located in folders called Season x?

 

I believe with the upcoming 3.6 release you should not see any issues with videos not showing up in a movie library.

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I decided to delete the jail and start again but I really don't quite understand which user/group should own the files and what the relationship is regarding users/groups within the jail/outside the jail.

 

The box has 16GB of ram but I had assumed that given Kodi could play the files without transcoding, that Emby would just send them as is. Is there a way to tell it not to transcode?

 

Can we please look at an example? thanks.

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