Plex introduces native commercial removal!

[tdiguy 96]

Exactly how do you expect them to pay the expenses (and people) required to produce and deliver that content to you?

If i remember correctly dish and the whole prime time auto channel skip had a big to do with the stations.

And actually here is an article on it. https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160211/10423633579/dish-agrees-to-cripple-ad-skipping-dvr-to-settle-fox-lawsuit.shtml

I wonder what sort of attention plex will attract on this. It seems like something where it might be in emby's interest to stay clear of. I would like to have it in emby also sure, but it might be in embys best interest to not offer it.

[Jdiesel 1114]

Exactly how do you expect them to pay the expenses (and people) required to produce and deliver that content to you?

 

In the case of The Big Bang Theory pictured above the show is one big product placement for whatever they can manage to put on screen. That episode also only had a runtime of 18 minutes and aired during a 30 minute timeslot. I remember when primetime shows that aired during a 30 minute timeslot were 24 minutes. TV networks continue to dig themselves deeper and deeper into a hole by trying to milk every last advertising opportunity meanwhile the masses move over to other services like Netflix or Youtube for their entertainment.

[ucjb 14]

@tdiguy Just because it's offered as a feature does not mean it's illegal or else Emby and Plex would then both be illegal because of the ability to record shows.. Adding the feature does not constitute a crime.

[Jdiesel 1114]

I think I might give setting up Comskip a shot this weekend 

[legallink 187]

@tdiguy Just because it's offered as a feature does not mean it's illegal or else Emby and Plex would then both be illegal because of the ability to record shows.. Adding the feature does not constitute a crime.

@@ucjb I think you need to do a little more research.  DVR/Recording/Time Shifting was settled long ago and was more recently heard back in 2013 when Dish offered it's Hopper service.

 

There is a large difference from making a copy of something for personal use and providing a service that materially alters that content.  And yes, offering a feature can be illegal because that feature may be illegal.  A piece of open source software that provides an ability does not mean that the open source software does it legally.

 

http://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2014/01/24/12-57048%20web%20corrected.1.pdf

 

For your reading pleasure.

[ucjb 14]

@legallink

I'm certain Plex legal has discussed the various scenarios and have concluded no law(s) would be broken by adding the feature. Another option would be to add commercial detection and skipping and not cutting or removing them. If I'm not mistaken there are already programs that will let you skip commercials.

[tdiguy 96]

@legallink

I'm certain Plex legal has discussed the various scenarios and have concluded no law(s) would be broken by adding the feature. Another option would be to add commercial detection and skipping and not cutting or removing them. If I'm not mistaken there are already programs that will let you skip commercials.

Right I am sure dish offered it very Willy nilly as a service without consulting lawyers. I am also sure they didn't have a good legal team in court to mitigate the time money and effort the judgement cost them. Dish is a pretty large corporation I haven't looked it up but I bet they make Plex look pretty small income wise.

 

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[CBers 6790]

The option to remove COMMERCIALS in Plex is so simple. Just a checkbox when you set up the recording.

[ucjb 14]

"The San Jose, California, company hopes to avoid legal problems by leaving it to users to enable the feature, said TiVo Inc. Vice President Jim Denney."

https://www.cnbc.com/2015/09/30/new-tivo-dvr-will-skip-through-entire-commercial-break.html

[tdiguy 96]

I don't know, to me I see little difference between the three in this manner. Commercial skip was an option on dish also and only available during prime time. TiVo and Plex are offering it as an option all the time.

 

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[ucjb 14]

I don't know, to me I see little difference between the three in this manner. Commercial skip was an option on dish also and only available during prime time. TiVo and Plex are offering it as an option all the time.

 

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

To me, skipping commercials is like getting up and taking a piss. They cannot force people to watch the ads.

[blade005 172]

No configuration needed other than checking off the "Remove Commercials" option either in the global DVR settings or for the specific recording.  It took an extra 5 minutes or so to scan the file and remove the commercials as compared to a standard recording.

Only 5 minutes? You must have a 'beefy' system doing the scan. Was that 5 minutes to scan recording, identify commercials and remux a file without commercials?

 

I recall that ComSkip with DVRMSToolbox would create an EDL file that had markers for commercial skip points. Ideal situation would be a scan and creation of EDL Chapter file with same name as original recording that Emby could recognize and know that it includes commercial skip points for less beefy Emby host systems. That should be less CPU intensive and you would still have the original recording intact in case commercial recognition missed anything for override purposes.

Edited November 29, 2017 by blade005

[Jdiesel 1114]

I like the idea of having skip points as well. Problem is that not all clients might not support them.

[mguebert 9]

I would like this also, however the method plex is using is to remove the commercials cutting them out of the recording. Instead I would like to use a EDL cut list, which then can be used to skip commercials either via a button or automatically. This is how I used to have it setup when I was using media portal and cablecard.

[legallink 187]

Skipping commercials is more legally viable (although I'd be surprised if Tivo isn't sued), but removing commercials completely just smells like a problem coming quickly. 

[legallink 187]

I love the idea of implementing EDL....there are a lot of uses for it.

[tdiguy 96]

@tdiguy Just because it's offered as a feature does not mean it's illegal or else Emby and Plex would then both be illegal because of the ability to record shows.. Adding the feature does not constitute a crime.

Recording programming that is broadcast freely over the air is one of those things that actually has set legal precedence. From back when there was betamax and vcr's. The technology has changed but that does not change the legal precedence that has been set. It is perfectly legal to record your own personal copy of a show. Now if you make copies of it and distribute or sell it that is a whole different can of worms and generally illegal such as setting up a torrent and sharing it, even if it is freely available legally unless you get special permission to distribute said content you could face steep fines. You can also legally make a personal copy of any piece of software you own, same thing applies dont distribute it. 

[iamspartacus 40]

Only 5 minutes? You must have a 'beefy' system doing the scan. Was that 5 minutes to scan recording, identify commercials and remux a file without commercials?

 

I recall that ComSkip with DVRMSTollbox would create an EDL file that had markers for commercial skip points. Ideal situation would be a scan and creation of EDL Chapter file with same name as original recording that Emby could recognize and know that it includes commercial skip points for less beefy Emby host systems. That should be less CPU intensive and you would still have the original recording intact in case commercial recognition missed anything for override purposes.

 

Yes, that was 5 minutes to complete the entire post-processing of the file including scanning the recording, identify commericals, and remux without commercials.  These were only 30 minutes programs so take that into account.  This is being done on a Xeon D-1541 (8 core/16-threads).

[manicpanic 0]

+1 for EDL support. 

[ebr 14959]

TV networks continue to dig themselves deeper and deeper into a hole by trying to milk every last advertising opportunity meanwhile the masses move over to other services like Netflix or Youtube for their entertainment.

 

No, what they are doing is attempting to survive - which is really hard to do when most of your consumers expect services and content to all be provided to them - with absolutely no interruption - for free.

 

"Free" content has existed forever by being supported by advertisers.  When your user base does everything it can to avoid those ads, then advertisers demand that you do everything you can to make it so they can't.

[Jdiesel 1114]

No, what they are doing is attempting to survive - which is really hard to do when most of your consumers expect services and content to all be provided to them - with absolutely no interruption - for free.

 

"Free" content has existed forever by being supported by advertisers.  When your user base does everything it can to avoid those ads, then advertisers demand that you do everything you can to make it so they can't.

 

I know we are getting a bit off topic here but I think this is a perfect example of an old business model failing to adapt to current consumer demands. Netflix, Amazon, and Hulu are proving that premium original content can be delivered with no ads or select ads at lower tiers in the case of Hulu. It has been a slippery slope since the being of broadcast television to see how many ads TV networks could squeeze in.  Once upon a time paying for cable meant you weren't subject to the same advertisements required to supplement the free or basic cable channels but those days are long gone.

 

Don't get me started on the 20 minutes of ads before a movie at the cinema that is the new norm. Netflix gets more attractive with every passing day.

[tdiguy 96]

With how much money is paid to actors and such i think its less about survival and more about sheer greed. Actors arent even the most highly paid talent when it comes to tv productions so i can only imagine how much less need there would be to bombard consumers with commercials if more people took a more reasonable paycheck.

[ebr 14959]

I know we are getting a bit off topic here but I think this is a perfect example of an old business model failing to adapt to current consumer demands. 

 

So you are saying free (ad-supported) broadcast TV should just go away because it doesn't suit you?  If you like the pay-for-content model better, there are options for you.  I do think the world is changing here but as long as the "free" options are there, they have no choice but to try and survive based on advertising.

[Jdiesel 1114]

With how much money is paid to actors and such i think its less about survival and more about sheer greed. Actors arent even the most highly paid talent when it comes to tv productions so i can only imagine how much less need there would be to bombard consumers with commercials if more people took a more reasonable paycheck.

 

Once again the BBT example, each of the 5 original cast members earn $1 million per episode with the total production cost being $9 million per episode. While seasons 1-6 of Game of Throne got by with only $6 million per episode. To make matters worse BBT has the nerve to shove products like Vitamin Water down your throat every chance they get by displaying clearly up front on the coffee table and cut the runtime down to 18 minutes.

[ebr 14959]

And, I still have my original question.  You don't like the fact that these TV sources are using more intrusive ad techniques (because everyone is skipping the conventional ones).  But, you must still want to consume this content or why would you care about the ads being there?

 

So... how do you propose they stay in business so that they can continue to provide you this content if not through advertising?