Lots of tuners being held open

[CharlieMurphy 73]

Not sure why this seems worse than ever. Server Version 4.7.11.0. I restarted it yesterday and already it had 3 streams being streamed while nothing is in the dashboard. Restarting the server released all three. Just giving feedback, I know this is an ongoing issue.

[CharlieMurphy 73]

The clients would be mostly the Android TV version, but one of the channels that were locked was played in the "Samsung Smart TV" client this morning.

[Luke 37067]

Hi there, let's look at an example:

How to Report a Problem

Thanks.

[CharlieMurphy 73]

@LukeI'm sorry if you've explained this before but this has been an issue for years now but I'm still in the dark. 

1. Why does the server dashboard know the client has disconnected while the backend doesn't?

2. Why does the dashboard not know an ffmpeg session is still running while the backend does?

The server is obviously aware there is still an ffmpeg session using a tuner, as indicated by it not allowing a new session if the tuner limit is reached. On the other hand the dashboard is aware that the client is long gone, as indicated by the session disappearing.

The correct information is obviously there but somehow detached. There seems to be several of us wondering how this is an issue still. Obviously it's more complicated than I understand, maybe it would be less frustrating if I had some understanding of the challenges.

[pepinacosplus 6]

Common problem that Emby has been dragging for more than 2 years.

Don't have much faith that this will be fixed. Just install a management panel between emby and the tuners and finish them manually when you see that sessions are not really in use.

[pepinacosplus 6]

Common problem that Emby has been dragging for more than 2 years.

Don't have much faith that this will be fixed. Just install a management panel between emby and the tuners and finish them manually when you see that sessions are not really in use. Its awful solution because sometimes you are not in home and cant access to that panel and the streams keep holding the tuners and wasting LAN bandwitch but that what it is. Live TV is pretty broken from the start and the lack of updates and a roadmap does not give much confidence.

[Spaceboy 2493]

i assume this is with hdhomerun tuners? as i don't see it with m3u tuners streamingfrom a local tv server

[CharlieMurphy 73]

m3u IPTV and also HDHR. It had been better but not perfect, then some days are just worse.

[Spaceboy 2493]

with HDHR i assume that you are able to see the open streams in their own software?

but where/how do you see that iptv streams are still open?

[neik 837]

3 hours ago, Spaceboy said:

but where/how do you see that iptv streams are still open?

When your transcoding keeps filling up your disk for instance.

At least that's how I notice as my network tuner has 4 tuners and I usually only use two of them, so no issue on the playback side only when my disk is full.
Interesting I can't even see a hint in the Emby log but still it keeps filling the transcoding folder.

Restarting Emby is the only solution but this is a pretty annoying issue.

[CharlieMurphy 73]

There are several indications:

Many years ago my provider at the time had a dashboard and that showed how many slots were in use. Emby would hold one or more open until I restart it's container.

As neik said, transcoding folder will fill.

Currently I use TVHeadend as an intermediary and the status tab shows me what Emby is up to.

Most puzzling though is that Emby logs themselves will tell you that you have hit the tuner limit you set for that source in Emby. THAT function of Emby is accurate. It knows we have 4 tuners being used when the dashboard displays nothing. That's what I want to understand. Emby staff is aware, years ago I was told here that the solution was to not use tuner the limit setting in Emby. That doesn't free up my streaming slots from the HDHR or the IPTV provider though.

I think I'd feel better if I could dream up a reason that Emby is aware of the stream to the extent that it refuses to open another stream if the limit is hit, yet the dashboard is aware that the client using that stream is gone. It seems like all the info is there for the taking, why does this feel like voodoo? There must be a complexity that I don't understand...

Edited May 8, 2023 by CharlieMurphy

[richt 73]

To fix the HDHomerun tuners left open, ou can just restart the tuner without restarting Emby.  As long as one of the tuners isn't really in use, it is a less invasive solution.

[CharlieMurphy 73]

I haven't found that to be true in all cases. In my experience, Emby server tries to re-establish the connection. Restarting Emby is the universal fix.

[Spaceboy 2493]

and this happens with every stream you open or just some? i notice that when i watch live tv on my shield nothing gets created in the transcoding folder and 9/10 times this is how i watch live tv

but if i watch in a browser, even if it direct plays i do get files created in the transcoding folder but they are all cleared immediately on stopping the stream

[CharlieMurphy 73]

Just occasional, I wouldn't say rare. If a Roku plays live TV, it is likely. The home-key-press-exit gets blamed for that, but that's a red herring. I've played channels on Roku and hid the remote to make sure nobody is walking in and pressing the home key. If an ATSC channel has a weak signal to the HDHR, it's also likely to happen.

At this point it's been so long that I don't expect a fix and I don't have the desire to troubleshoot it anymore, but I would just love to have an explanation as to how the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. There must be some reason it's hard to code.

[CharlieMurphy 73]

1 hour ago, CharlieMurphy said:

I think I'd feel better if I could dream up a reason that Emby is aware of the stream to the extent that it refuses to open another stream if the limit is hit, yet the dashboard is aware that the client using that stream is gone.

I really think this is the crux. This is what makes me frustrated. There must be an explanation.

[neik 837]

28 minutes ago, Spaceboy said:

and this happens with every stream you open or just some? i notice that when i watch live tv on my shield nothing gets created in the transcoding folder and 9/10 times this is how i watch live tv

but if i watch in a browser, even if it direct plays i do get files created in the transcoding folder but they are all cleared immediately on stopping the stream

I would need to double check but iirc in my case even with the Shield it creates the transcode files.

Unfortunately, this is random behavior which causes the server to run out of space (rather soon than later).

[Spaceboy 2493]

20 minutes ago, neik said:

I would need to double check but iirc in my case even with the Shield it creates the transcode files.

Unfortunately, this is random behavior which causes the server to run out of space (rather soon than later).

you must be doing something to transcode the stream - maybe the option in relation to interlaced? not that it really matters in relation to your problem...

[CharlieMurphy 73]

TS -> HLS for seeking in the ATV app?

[ebr 14913]

21 hours ago, CharlieMurphy said:

The home-key-press-exit gets blamed for that, but that's a red herring.

Hi.  It really isn't as that will definitely create the situation where a tuner can get stranded.  The Roku app has no ability to shut down the stream when you exit it like that so the server has to rely on other means to try and determine that the consumer is no longer there.  So anything you can do to minimize that usage will undoubtedly help.

There could also be other scenarios that can cause the same situation but that is definitely one.

[neik 837]

I think there needs to be a better handling between the server and the clients or the needs to be a way to kill those open streams - not only for live TV btw.

Right now there is a open stream in my dashboard that was started >3hours ago with a playtime of 1h.
I would expect the client to send some sort of "force kill stream" after an hour or so of inactivity.

Just my 2cents though...

[ebr 14913]

Just now, neik said:

I would expect the client to send some sort of "force kill stream" after an hour or so of inactivity.

The client cannot do anything when it has been terminated by the system .  That is what happens when you use the "home" button on the Roku.

So, the server is left to try and determine if the app has really gone away or if someone has just run into a temporary issue or something.  There is logic in the server to do that but it is more complex than it may seem.  There are obviously still some situations that can slip through - but, they are actually rare which makes it even harder to chase down.

For instance, my server has been up for I think 73 days straight and I've never had a stranded stream.  Most have a similar experience but, alas, you are not so we just need to figure out why.

[Spaceboy 2493]

why doesnt "are you still watching" help here? or is it that emby doesnt even know that the stream is still running?

[ebr 14913]

Just now, Spaceboy said:

why doesnt "are you still watching" help here?

That is managed by each app.  If the app is "gone" it won't come into play.

[pünktchen 1258]

5 minutes ago, ebr said:

So, the server is left to try and determine if the app has really gone away or if someone has just run into a temporary issue or something.

Mmh, but every Emby app is sending playback progress every few seconds to the server. If the server doesn't get it from the client for a few minutes, it has to asume the client is gone and just stop streaming, release the tuner and so on.