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Should I convert MPG files in EMBY server libraries?


HoosierDaddy
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HoosierDaddy

Maybe bad at searching but dd not find the answer in knowledge base.

I have many MPG files from DVDs and other sources.

I only use Roku EMBY app to access the videos in EMBY Server running on a Win 10 HTPC. 

Everything has always played fine but I'm not sure if EMBY sever converts them to the format the TV wants or if the ROKU app does it. If EMBY server is doing it, I would consider transcoding them myself, particularly if the file sizes would be reduced and/or a higher quality picture would result from one-time off-line transcoding. 

Thoughts? 

Edited by HoosierDaddy
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5 hours ago, HoosierDaddy said:

Maybe bad at searching but dd not find the answer in knowledge base.

I have many MPG files from DVDs and other sources.

I only use Roku EMBY app to access the videos in EMBY Server running on a Win 10 HTPC. 

Everything has always played fine but I'm not sure if EMBY sever converts them to the format the TV wants or if the ROKU app does it. If EMBY server is doing it, I would consider transcoding them myself, particularly if the file sizes would be reduced and/or a higher quality picture would result from one-time off-line transcoding. 

Thoughts? 

Interesting question. What container are these MPEG1 inside of MKV or AVI? If it were MKV we would have good news. You can quickly remux AVI into MKV. Then these would eventually direct play on your Roku.

We will be updating the capabilities of the Roku app to include the ability to direct play more codecs. With some caveats. Stay tuned on that end.

Edited by speechles
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Dickydodah!

I'm guessing that as these files are from DVDs they will be MPEG-2 format (aka H. 262). These should play directly on your Roku.

Video — H.264/AVC (.MKV, .MP4, .MOV), on Roku 4 only: H.265/HEVC (.MKV, .MP4, .MOV); VP9 (.MKV)

If you want to save space and have the correct version of Roku then conversion to H.265 may be worthwhile.

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Emby reads the supported codecs directly from your Roku device.

Those codecs, at present, can be any of these: mpeg1, mpeg2, h263 (xvid/divx), mpeg4 (avc), h264, vp8, vp9, hevc, av1.

We will have an update to our Roku app soon to add better support for these codecs. Stay tuned. ^_~

Edited by speechles
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HoosierDaddy
17 hours ago, speechles said:

Interesting question. What container are these MPEG1 inside of MKV or AVI? If it were MKV we would have good news. You can quickly remux AVI into MKV. Then these would eventually direct play on your Roku.

We will be updating the capabilities of the Roku app to include the ability to direct play more codecs. With some caveats. Stay tuned on that end.

I'm not clear on distinctions between containers and file extensions. But almost all my video files in the EMBY server libraries are either .MPG or .MP4. So, was asking about the .MPGs.

99% of .MPGs were output from VideoRedo since it could allow edits AND avoid recoding of these sources. Sources were VIDEO_TS folders of DVDs or files from SD Dish DVRs which did not copy protect non-premium content. Been quite some time since extracting "SD" from the Dish DVR so don't even recall the file extensions. Some .MP4s are also from HD Dish DVRs and IIRC those files had .TS extensions. All of the files from Dish have atypical resolutions (if that's the proper term) 1080x1440 for the .MP4s and 544x480 for the .MPGs.

All this is making me realize it's almost certain there is conversion other than what the TV is doing to upscale to UHD 4K even for the .MP4s.

 

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HoosierDaddy
Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Dickydodah! said:

I'm guessing that as these files are from DVDs they will be MPEG-2 format (aka H. 262). These should play directly on your Roku.

Video — H.264/AVC (.MKV, .MP4, .MOV), on Roku 4 only: H.265/HEVC (.MKV, .MP4, .MOV); VP9 (.MKV)

If you want to save space and have the correct version of Roku then conversion to H.265 may be worthwhile.

They play now on my Roku Ultra. 

I would like to save space but only if picture quality looks the same or BETTER. I guess I'm worried that real-time recoding might be sacrificing quality and recoding off-line would ensure the server or Roku aren't sacrificing picture quality to keep up.

Edited by HoosierDaddy
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HoosierDaddy
Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, speechles said:

Emby reads the supported codecs directly from your Roku device.

Those codecs, at present, can be any of these: mpeg1, mpeg2, h263 (xvid/divx), mpeg4 (avc), h264, vp8, vp9, hevc, av1.

We will have an update to our Roku app soon to add better support for these codecs. Stay tuned. ^_~

Okay, does that mean the server is definitely recoding my MPG files even if the Roku supports the existing format of the files? Or would server be forced to only because of the atypical resolutions of many of the MPGs (544x480)? Or does the server count on the Roku to do the recoding to whatever the TV wants and sends the Mpeg2 video straight thru and lets the Roku deal with the resolution?

Edited by HoosierDaddy
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18 minutes ago, HoosierDaddy said:

I'm not clear on distinctions between containers and file extensions. But almost all my video files in the EMBY server libraries are either .MPG or .MP4. So, was asking about the .MPGs.

99% of .MPGs were output from VideoRedo since it could allow edits AND avoid recoding of these sources. Sources were VIDEO_TS folders of DVDs or files from SD Dish DVRs which did not copy protect non-premium content. Been quite some time since extracting "SD" from the Dish DVR so don't even recall the file extensions. Some .MP4s are also from HD Dish DVRs and IIRC those files had .TS extensions. All of the files from Dish have atypical resolutions (if that's the proper term) 1080x1440 for the .MP4s and 544x480 for the .MPGs.

All this is making me realize it's almost certain there is conversion other than what the TV is doing to upscale to UHD 4K even for the .MP4s.

 

The Roku does not understand the MPG extension. You can through drag and drop these onto MKVToolNix GUI. Tell it repackage them into MKV from MPG. Just remux. Do not change the video codec from mpeg1video. Remux takes a few seconds. The Roku can direct play MPEG1 VIDEO inside MKV and direct play.

The information that other fellow is giving you is outdated, wrong, and not accurate.

The containers that can direct play are MOV, MKV, and MP4. The codecs, at present, that direct play can be any of these: mpeg1, mpeg2, h263 (xvid/divx), mpeg4 (avc), h264, vp8, vp9, hevc, av1. The specific Roku device you own determines which codecs can direct play. A brand new Roku will of course play all of the above being brand new. Your mileage will vary with older Roku units. We read supported codecs directly from the device. It is device specific. That is why it is hard to give you a list or give you more information. Without knowing which Roku you are using that is impossible. Hope you understand. :)

TS/M2TS can direct play but do not produce a seekable stream. You cannot fast-forward or rewind. We do not direct play TS or M2TS. We REMUX them into a directstream.

 

We need to update our capabilities profile inside the Roku application. Once that update happens you will have everything mentioned above. We are working on it.

Edited by speechles
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HoosierDaddy
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, speechles said:

The Roku does not understand the MPG extension. You can through drag and drop these onto MKVToolNix GUI. Tell it repackage them into MKV from MPG. Just remux. Do not change the video codec from mpeg1video. Remux takes a few seconds. The Roku can direct play MPEG1 VIDEO inside MKV and direct play.

Okay but I don't understand what the server is doing to make the video playable on the Roku. As I said, they play fine, so it sounds like the Emby server or Emby Roku app is doing something to my .MPG files before passing them to Roku?

Edited by HoosierDaddy
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8 minutes ago, HoosierDaddy said:

Okay but I don't understand what the server is doing to make the video playable on the Roku. As I said, they play fine, so it sounds like the Emby server or Emby Roku app is doing something to my .MPG files before passing them to Roku?

Right now the answer is in the stats for nerds on your Roku. Press DOWN and find the Cog/Gear and press it. You will find an option called "Enable stats for nerds" with NO shown next to it. Click it and this turns to YES and you will see a visible text display overlaid onto the video. That text display will give you reasons for transcoding. What the video codec is, what it is after streaming, and etc. You can see into what is happening on the Roku during playback.

The MPG right now is being transcoded into H264.

We need to finish the work on our capabilities profile on the Roku then issue an update to the application. Once that is done you will find the Roku is direct playing things it never has before. But things need to be inside an MKV container not just bare MPG.

image.png.2928dcde9deda13c1efc3fc20eb84206.png

After the update... seen above. The present application in Store/Beta form cannot do this yet. This update is coming shortly.

Edited by speechles
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To answer the question: The Roku application is giving the server a capabilities profile of what it detects the Roku can direct play and direct stream. The Roku application is in charge of reading the device and reporting those capabilities to the server. The server then checks the media item against those reported capabilities. If the server finds anything out in that media item is not within the specification of the capabilities the Roku reported then it will enforce transcoding. The video, audio, and subtitles may need transcoding for the Roku. Rather than you having to work to figure out exactly how you can get the best performance out of your Roku that is what Emby is for. Emby will provide the best performance and experience on your Roku device because it is intimately familiar with what your Roku device can do.

We are in the process of updating those capabilities to better match what Roku can do today. This is to make it easier for you without having to understand what codecs or containers even are. You can just press play. Everything else is up to us. If the playback fails we failed you. At that point you come here and make a post and we do exactly as we are doing now. We solve the problem. :0)

Edited by speechles
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