All users having stuttering and buffering problems

[wakeboarder141 40]

I have 3 different users that reported to me at the same time that they are having playback problems.  Stuttering, buffering, jumping backwards and forwards, losing sound, etc.  Can someone tell in this log if it is a network issue on my end or something else causing it?  One user was transcoding, but the others were not.  I'm not sure if my internet is just being overtaxed or what.

embyserver.txt

[wakeboarder141 40]

Restarted my router, modem, and NAS.  Only have a single user now, and he is still having problems with the time jumping around.  Here is another log of him playing Yellowstone.

embyserver2.txt

[Luke 42078]

Hi, please try having the user lower the in-app quality setting and see if that helps. thanks.

[wakeboarder141 40]

1 minute ago, Luke said:

Hi, please try having the user lower the in-app quality setting and see if that helps. thanks.

How low should they go?  My files are all between 8-11Mbps for the most part so I try to keep them set there to avoid transcoding normally.  Is there a particular speed I should have them try? 

[Luke 42078]

It depends on what the connection can handle. i would try 1 mbps and work your way up from there as you see success.

[wakeboarder141 40]

13 minutes ago, Luke said:

It depends on what the connection can handle. i would try 1 mbps and work your way up from there as you see success.

Setting it to 1Mbps would force transcoding to always happen since the files are larger than that correct?  I have always had them set their speed around 10Mbps so everything direct plays because I was worried that having multiple users all transcoding at once would overtax my NAS.  Does the log make it look like this is a network problem on my side, or can you tell?

[Luke 42078]

The vast majority of stuttering problems are due to data not getting from one place to the other quickly enough, so that's why I suggested to reduce the bitrate. There's no way for me to tell which side of the connection is the limiting factor.

[wakeboarder141 40]

1 minute ago, Luke said:

The vast majority of stuttering problems are due to data not getting from one place to the other quickly enough, so that's why I suggested to reduce the bitrate. There's no way for me to tell which side of the connection is the limiting factor.

OK, I will play around with that.  Thank you for your time.

[wakeboarder141 40]

Most of the buffering issues are pretty intermittent so it has been hard to nail down, but I am leaning towards internet problems on their end.  One question I had, when a file needs transcoded, what determines the bitrate it will be converted to?  For example, I had a user that had their speed set to 8Mbps, they played a file that was 12Mbps, and the transcoding says it is running around 3Mbps.  I would have thought it would shoot for closer to 8Mbps where his speed is set?

[Carlo 4561]

It could be the client requested 3Mb because of client settings but you said it was set to 8Mb.  That would seem to indicate the transcode took place with a max bitrate of 8Mb but only need 3Mb.

If you could post a ffmpeg transcode log we can look at it for you.

[wakeboarder141 40]

I guess I don't understand the transcoding process well enough to answer that.  It looked like it transcoded at around 3Mbps until it hit 100%, then it showed it playing at 8Mbps for the rest of the show.  I assume that means the quality was less while it was transcoding correct?  That doesn't seem like the correct way for it to be handled.

ffmpeg-transcode-afe4c52d-ae1d-4435-bc66-1d690c84cd41_1.txt

[Luke 42078]

Based on this log it appears the quality setting in the app is still higher at around 8 mpbs. I would try lowering it.

[wakeboarder141 40]

9 minutes ago, Luke said:

Based on this log it appears the quality setting in the app is still higher at around 8 mpbs. I would try lowering it.

In the app on the client end?  He did have it set to 8Mbps which is why I didn't understand the 3Mbps transcoding.  If they lower it, it will always force transcoding, which seems like it would be taxing on the server.  Would it not be better to direct play the files?

[Carlo 4561]

Yes, I don't think Luke understood the question.

[Luke 42078]

On 3/3/2021 at 1:20 PM, wakeboarder141 said:

Would it not be better to direct play the files?

Sure, but if the network connection can't sustain the higher bitrate smoothly then you need to make a choice about how to proceed.

How are things now?

[wakeboarder141 40]

18 minutes ago, Luke said:

Sure, but if the network connection can't sustain the higher bitrate smoothly then you need to make a choice about how to proceed.

How are things now?

That user seems to be OK leaving his settings at the 8Mbps for now, but it does mean he is transcoding on almost every file.  I think most of the problem stemmed from network issues on the users' end.  Unfortunately, even though my network can support direct play to all of my users at once, some of their equipment doesn't seem up to the task.

[Luke 42078]

Exactly, and that's why you might need the transcoding, or to pre-convert your files to lower bitrates. Thanks for the feedback.

[rbjtech 5284]

I would suggest if they are marginal at 8Mbps - then I would set the max bitrate setting for that user to say 5Mbps to give them some headroom.  You don't want unreliable streaming and be getting 'support' calls ... 

 

[wakeboarder141 40]

3 hours ago, rbjtech said:

I would suggest if they are marginal at 8Mbps - then I would set the max bitrate setting for that user to say 5Mbps to give them some headroom.  You don't want unreliable streaming and be getting 'support' calls ... 

 

Haha yeah that is what I am dealing with now

[wakeboarder141 40]

Does transcoding to say 5Mbps take more server resources than transcoding the same file to 8Mbps?

[Guest]

I had this same issue on my home network with Gigabit cards, Emby 4.5.4.0 installed on a 7040 Micro with NAS Shares as the data repositories. Playing on the same machine, I had to take mine down to the lowest settings of 1080p. but there had been occasions where I had to go lower. Curious too if there were settings errors somewhere.. like Mbps versus MBps.. My stuttering was playing in so far and then reversing but doing it so fast it was actually kind of funny.. The first movie I seen it in opened with someone running.. I tripped out.

[wakeboarder141 40]

1 minute ago, Hxemby001 said:

I had this same issue on my home network with Gigabit cards, Emby 4.5.4.0 installed on a 7040 Micro with NAS Shares as the data repositories. Playing on the same machine, I had to take mine down to the lowest settings of 1080p. but there had been occasions where I had to go lower. Curious too if there were settings errors somewhere.. like Mbps versus MBps.. My stuttering was playing in so far and then reversing but doing it so fast it was actually kind of funny.. The first movie I seen it in opened with someone running.. I tripped out.

I have around 10 users that don't seem to have any problem with direct play as the files are mostly in the 7Mbps to 10Mbps range, so I don't think the issue is on my side at this point.  I think I may just need to limit certain users.  I was just trying to make the server not have to work as hard, and I'm not sure how the transcoding works exactly.  It seems like one user transcoding a file will shoot the CPU usage up to 90% or so, and I'm not sure how many of those at once my server can handle.  I assume it will split the CPU resources for each transcode, but I don't know at what point that will overtax my NAS and start causing playback problems because of that.

[Guest]

Yeah.. You might consider your usage multiple... and if your serving this inter or intra - net... ( Web or Home ).. Your network card configuration..  and upload pipe. So 10 users.. using X Mbps = 10 x ( user Mbps ) equal to but less than your overall upload speed via your ISP or card configuration plus other usage...

Basic server issues.. from my day.. You might be maxxing it out leaving them for Direct Play.. plus usage after others log on and you reach peak usage times/criteria.

[rbjtech 5284]

10 hours ago, wakeboarder141 said:

Does transcoding to say 5Mbps take more server resources than transcoding the same file to 8Mbps?

Yes going lower bitrate while trying to maintain constant quality will make the system work 'harder' technically but at these bitrates it will make no perceivable difference at all.

 

[Carlo 4561]

Just to add to what tbjtech mentioned above.

Once you're causing a transcode to happen by reducing the bitrate it really make much difference to the computer running Emby.  A transcode to 5, 8 or 10Mb isn't going to much different at all.

So you could try 5Mb and work your way up to find the sweet spot.  So 5Mb might always work but 8Mb might not so then try 7 or 6 to find what works for that client.