Do I convert from P***

[Guest]

wondered if you helpful folk can help me if its worth the move. So I would like help from users and there experience.

I have a busy server. I have 4 family members that emigrated that use P*** literally 7 hours a day. i have converted my house so that the only way you watch anything is through my server.

as such over the years I have collected a various devices ranging from amazon 4K TV sticks to the dreaded android TV boxes. My setup server side is i have available 3x i7 vmware and a san. I am a IT solutions architect and the problem I face is infuriating as the fix is just so simple. 

Being a server man to me the client should be nothing. the client as long as that thing can put a picture on a TV and run the app that's its job. i understand some people will spend money on a shield but i have best part of 14 devices so 150 x 14 = cheaper to buy a server.

What makes my piss boil is the focus on client devices, its the excuse for everything not working an a simple option would solve it all. So here goes if this is dooable i cancel one suscription today and move everything over.

Seems like the fight to make sure everything gets to the client correctly seems to be a battle looking at both these forums and p*** formus that developers are losing.

so here goes the 100% fix that will solve 99% of my issues

Can embay server be force to encode or Remux everything. why? ... well look at how every problem is resolved when something is not working properly on a client device. turn subtitles on or lower the bitrate to force encoding. so why not do it on the server. 

My idea of a media server is I give a box to someone say press embay\pl*** and  enjoy. instead its oh that film is in 7.1 turn the subtitles on a sec and it will play it better blah blah blah.

just encode it server please. even if you thing the device can play it direct 99% of the time you cock it up between you so don't try. just encode stereo at xbit rate.

i saw some one on these forum suggest setting bitrates per device. If this is in Emby at this moment and time you can have my wallet, car keys. bugger it the wife i am in!!!!!

 

[Sammy 790]

If you have a powerful enough Server CPU and GPU you can force transcode on everything in the server settings but if the device doing the playback can handle the content why force the transcode?

You can set the bit rate here to force a transcode:

For more information on transcoding check here:

https://support.emby.media/support/solutions/folders/44000903016

 

[Sammy 790]

BTW, if Emby runs into a problem it will automatically switch to transcoding if needed before bailing on playback. Quite ingenious.

[Guest]

yeah ok same problem as p*** the problem i am trying to get around is the constant frustration of clients not telling the server its abelites correctly so to speak.

so internally i will set all to maximum, external to 50MBs then  the same on clients.

But 3 devices decide to tell the server it can play 7.1 audio 2 devices decide out the blue that Live TV cannot be played so switches to SD.

I want my server to force transcoding of every stream regardless of bitrate. so for example the one thing that the client and the server can reliably agree on is the resolution. so transcode everything to that device at 1080. basically if i don't i have to press something on the device to force it to do it anyway. from the screen shot I am still in the same position.

[Luke 42077]

Ok, the closest way to do that is with the in-app quality setting. If any of the users are on remote connections, you can also set the server bitrate limit per stream and that may help force transcoding.

[Q-Droid 989]

Are you using Emby yet or is this about hypotheticals?

Forcing the server to transcode everything (which is where it happens anyway) is not exactly a solution since it still has to know what the output must be, spec-wise. In other words transcoding is not a magic bullet to fix all problems.

It would be better to try Emby with the different clients and figure out what each one needs for the best experience. 

One example that I run into repeatedly is remote clients not reporting to the server the correct bandwidth available for playback. They consistently report low bitrate which in turn results in low quality (transcoded) streams. So I've told my remote users to set their playback bitrate to match their internet service speed. Then my server streams at its own limit, not theirs unless they have slow internet. Just one example...

 

[Guest]

ok so i went in and installed Emby, same problem, I have 2 amazon boxes to test. 1 is a cube 4k connected to my TV and one is a 4K stick connected to a 4K computer monitor.

Everything is set to stereo the monitor, the TV, the sticks. so play something and  direct play. so basically the server sends a 5.1 stream to a device that's set to stereo.basically some one talks and i am pressing the volume up, a tank drives past and i smash a window it so loud. For me to take any of these pieces of software seriously i want to be able to replace my current TV setup, in UK being sky TV,

but for me to have to start every movie by clicking start then change something like change resolution or anything to get it to encode just so it will force to play correctly is not acceptable, I agree with your statement above but just because the device can play 5.1 audio it, if the device itself is set to stereo only and you send a 5.1 audio stream to it something has gone wrong. 

 

OMMMMMGGGG = as i was just about to give up i look at the settings in the app.  Always downmix 

think this is a win boys, would still prefer if the server did it but then other devices would suffer ( i have no 7.1 or 5.1 ) but understand i am not everyone

[Guest]

well firesticks was perfect, transcode live TV and downmix to stereo solved all my problems. so I decided to revive i couple of old Andriod boxes.

gutted because these to options was not on them. to be honest I know the boxes are not the best but i could play 1080p films and TV and watch twitch streams at 1080P 60fps

 

Nothings playable with out these to options.  TV at 1080 is laggy, the films sound is all over the place, most films dont play. so i am in the same place overall. I have only revived one box will try another.

 

[Guest]

Ok i am going to have a wild punt. using both systems and over all the same problem. This could be a garbage idea. It seems a problem users seem to have both sides of the fence plex and emby. i am not a coder but a high level IT guy so maybe a feature request. my guess the problem with most apps and sound is the following.

the App is reporting back to the server what the device can do not what the device is set to only with audio.

For example with the video stream my 4K fire stick can do up to 4k and if I plug it into a 4k monitor and pass it a 4K stream it should play direct. But if i plug the 4K stick into a 1080p monitor the server would not pass it a 4K stream it would transcode. Brilliant

But this is not happening with audio. My 4K fire TV can do 7.1 audio. but not when its plugged into a TV with 2 speakers lol. but the result is the server still passes the 7.1 because the device can do it and the bloody stick just plays it resulting in awful experience. both systems i have the same fate of sitting with the remote in my lap turning up and down.

 looking at other systems and even PC's you tell the app what kind of sound system you have. so in emby you can have an audio system setting that says stereo, 5.1 blah blah which you set as your default. then the app will always ask the server for the correct type of audio stream.

 

[Luke 42077]

Quote

But this is not happening with audio. My 4K fire TV can do 7.1 audio. but not when its plugged into a TV with 2 speakers lol. but the result is the server still passes the 7.1 because the device can do it and the bloody stick just plays it resulting in awful experience.

For us, this is unfortunately a lose-lose situation. If the device can play 7.1 and down-sample to stereo, this is most desirable outcome as it avoids server transcoding. The only time this becomes a problem is when the device doesn't have very good down-sampling.

If we were to have this always transcode on the server, then there would be a much larger crowd of users who would be very upset about that, so that is the reason for the default behavior. But having options is one way to alleviate this.

[Guest]

yeah its the ongoing argument I and others seem to have with plex that yes it would downgrade some people but they can quite happily pick there default sound device as 7.1. Logically not all the time I know we have boxes plugged into TVs we have mobiles to. boxes that plug into TVs are more static. I would imagine more people have speakers than 7.1 systems on the whole. If the Apps was detecting that I was using stereo and converted it well then i would be a happy bunny. The Emby App has always mixdown to stereo  which was such a game changer I brought a premium pass immediately and this local mixdown was perfect. but this setting was not on the other devices so it was short lived. i noticed playing 4k that Emby app struggled to play vids that the plex app breezed through. not tested but may be the overhead of transcoding the audio.

but when you plug something in the jack of a PC and the screen pops up what did you just plug in, that's a £1000 PC with years of R&D behind telling you i don't know if your a 5.1 headphone a speaker or 7.1 so do us a favour you tell me!!. and we are trying to get £40 boxes to finally solve it. Movies extra can just be unwatchable but I feel I am being punished for not having a 7.1 system setup and spending more on the server side of things than the devices. i feel get the server to do the work. but i understand that most people dont have a 1080 and i7 at the ready for transcoding!

 

but having the option is the key, if my server which has the capacity to  transcoded or remuxed everything the device becomes almost a none factor that would be utopia for me. The audio thing would still be a problem overall as obviously it would just encode to 7.1. Twitch and utube can play in anything and because everything is encoded to certain parameters .

basically if I could access the ffmpeg settings myself I could find sweet spots for my devices and job done. 

 

sorry its late in the UK and think i went off topic a bit night!

 

[Q-Droid 989]

Would it be too much trouble for you to add a downmixed stereo stream to the media using ffmpeg? Then devices lacking the force option could use that track. You could even make it the default audio stream and keep the x.1 in the video file for users who want surround sound during playback.

 

 

[Guest]

I have vids that have a stereo stream in them, I put a movie on live TV and it sets it to 5.1. Out of the 10 or so devices I use nothing is 5.1. I cant use 5.1, I don't own 5.1 as a result it sounds awful. Why if i was to install the netflix app and watch the same thing that would be in stereo. it makes no sense. i can show screenshots  if you like

[Guest]

Ok I will tell you where I am at. 1 year ago I started this trip of setting up my own media server. I am not a tip your toe in kind of guy. I do not just want a Qnap and shield to watch the odd movie. This was going to be the way all my media is watched over the house, that is/was my plan. HomerunHD purchased the rest I kind of had. 
So off I went and its been enjoyable at the most, but I think this could be at the end of the road. So, I have 7 boxes in the house. The only way you can watch anything in my house is with either Emby or Plex. I am amazed and what it can do or could be. 
I was so impressed with it I started a handing out a few boxes to friends and family. 3 of my close relatives have emigrated so this has been in ingenious way of getting a little bit of England to them. But all overall all that has happened is the people I gave box is they have watched a couple of things then just used the box I gave to put Netflix on it. And why because it sounds terrible. I understand that some people do have the right sound equipment. I could possibly buy a 7.1 sound system for the front room, but I think it would be overkill for the kitchen when I just want to watch the news.

I really don’t want to explain to my 70 year old mum that she does not have a 7.1 sound system so every movie she tries to watch she needs to go to the bottom of the screen click on the sound button and change it every movie she watches. 

The end of the road was over the weekend, I think. I put a show on my media server for my house mate. I came home and she had downloaded Netfix and watched it on that. I felt like I had been cheated on! When I asked why she says it plays properly. And finally, I had no fight left in me and could only agree. 
I look at my server and looked at what it used for now and its only live TV, everything else is too much of arse to play. Every movie takes a series of pre flight checks before it will sound right.
So, I am at the stage that I may as well just download the Homerun APP and sign up to Netflix’s myself. I save myself the power to the server the space and the annoyance.
So the questions I ask myself is how can the Netfix app correctly play the right resolution and play the sound to the actual sound I have 100% of the time, it never fails. Pre transcoding. I stand here and look at a i7 doing nothing and just think mate come on do something!!! 
I could pre transcode everything but that in terms of space is just inefficient. Then if I did by a 7.1 sound system then it is different libraries for different devices, and I am not sure that’s going to scale. We do not have to have a library for 1080 and then pre transcode everything to 720 because some of our devices are not 1080. And if asked you do that would you not find it unacceptable?

So, I will keep an hopeful eye on both forums. I think adding features is one thing but until play back is consent its media server 0, massive global bastards that can make it play right 1.

 

[CBers 7450]

@OllieP From reading your posts above, it seems you have a mixture of Amazon devices and non-Android TV devices.

The Amazon Stick devices are quite underpowered for what they are, so any kind of "magic" being done on the device may cause issues.

I assume you are using the Amby Android TV (ATV) app on them all ?

Make sure that they all have the latest Stable release of the app available (see below).

There is a beta channel with all of the latest bug fixes etc., but probably best not to use for your remote users.

Emby for Android TV
Google Devices
Stable: v1.8.24g (2020/08/13)
Beta: v1.8.41g (2020/10/12)

Amazon Devices
Stable: v1.8.24a (2020/08/13)
Beta: v1.8.41g (2020/10/12)
Stable Release Notes
Beta Release Notes

There is an "Emby: Latest Versions" thread that tracks the latest version of the most popular apps etc.

If you have any issues with any clients, or the server, you can always follow the How to Report a Problem link and supply the information requested within it.

In the ATV app, there is the DOWNMIX TO STEREO option that you have already found. For your users that don't have any HD audio capabilities, then set that option to be used always (I have done that for my relatives who have a under-powered servers and struggle to transcode/remux).

The Nvidia Shield TV devices are the best available at the present time, but they are expensive, so it's understandable when people buy cheaper devices. Please bear in mind that not all of the cheap Android devices are Android TV compatible, so you may run into issues again.

There is also the Knowledge Base that has loads of useful tips and help.

Any further questions, please shout.
 

Edited October 19, 2020 by CBers

[Guest]

They are all the latest 4k sticks from amazon and sorry mate there not underpowered. and the main box i do the testing on is a 4k cube and spec wise it beats most over things and all my devices can play Netflix and watch a movie in stereo? why is 7.1 the default. any way thanks for your help but i think its time i give it up.

Its not a question of power. it a question of being bale to play the right audio track for the equipment i have. Luke was very helpful and i think he understood where i am going.

If my device is 1080P but my TV is only 720p you would be more than happy for the server to transcode? but if the audio track is 7.1 and my device is set to stereo you argue that i should buy a 7.1 system or another client. 

[Guest]

sorry but look this is not right please explain this if you can i will just admit i am wrong and never post again. this is the exact setup in this example. 

Amazon 4k cube latest and greatest, plugged into a 1080 TV with a stereo sound bar watching HD TV in the UK via Freeview and being passed to Emby via my HomerunHD.

There is nothing in this equation that is 5.1 

so why does this happen 

 

[Guest]

as a result play back is awfull!

[CBers 7450]

18 minutes ago, OllieP said:

They are all the latest 4k sticks from amazon and sorry mate there not underpowered. and the main box i do the testing on is a 4k cube and spec wise it beats most over things and all my devices can play Netflix and watch a movie in stereo? why is 7.1 the default. any way thanks for your help but i think its time i give it up.

Its not a question of power. it a question of being bale to play the right audio track for the equipment i have. Luke was very helpful and i think he understood where i am going.

If my device is 1080P but my TV is only 720p you would be more than happy for the server to transcode? but if the audio track is 7.1 and my device is set to stereo you argue that i should buy a 7.1 system or another client. 

OK, perhaps it's the original Amazon sticks that are under powered.

No-one is suggesting you but a 7.1 system, so you may have misread that.

Not all client devices are the same, so tinkering with options to suit your needs within the capabilities of the device are required.

Also, you may need to change some settings on the server to accommodate remote user's needs.

It's upto you what you decide to do, but if you decide to stay and work with the people in this community, your experience will only get better.

If you decide to go elsewhere, then that is your prerogative.

Thanks.

[CBers 7450]

9 minutes ago, OllieP said:

as a result play back is awfull!

Expand on "play back is awful" ?

Also, aren't those options the device's options, rather than the options within the app ?

Have you explored all of the options within the ATV app itself ?
 

[Guest]

the last example its all I got. I hope it helps the best an do. all in lol.

Lets say you have any device that is set to TV that is set to 720 but your device can do 1080. if the device can do 1080 it works out that you can only view in 720. Correct. so lets say you cant do that. as a result every single thing that you played you would have to go through the motions of changing the resolution. watch TV set it to 720. deciced to watch a film and have to press the 720. slowly you would feel that this is not usable to much hassell. but the devices and the app cannot work out the audio so setting it and helping it would sort it.

anyway good luck lads lol

[Guest]

play back is awful because you cannot hear dialogue and when a car drives past it rattles the windows

[CBers 7450]

1 minute ago, OllieP said:

the last example its all I got. I hope it helps the best an do. all in lol.

Lets say you have any device that is set to TV that is set to 720 but your device can do 1080. if the device can do 1080 it works out that you can only view in 720. Correct. so lets say you cant do that. as a result every single thing that you played you would have to go through the motions of changing the resolution. watch TV set it to 720. deciced to watch a film and have to press the 720. slowly you would feel that this is not usable to much hassell. but the devices and the app cannot work out the audio so setting it and helping it would sort it.

anyway good luck lads lol

I think you're getting yourself confused.

We're here to help if you want it, but if not ........

[Guest]

explain why i am confused

 

[Guest]

There is setting in any of the apps that a set that tells the App i can only listen in stereo, both in plex or emby.