3D Playback

[KaraokeAmerica 0]

I am a newbie and trying to confirm something here. Can Emby serve/play real frame-sequential, full resolution 3D as well as TAB/SBS?

 

I have been looking here and it talks about file naming, but I can't seem to find actual specs and capabilities:

 

https://github.com/MediaBrowser/Wiki/wiki/3D%20videos

 

Is there someplace where I can see the actual file formats Emby handles?

 

I'm trying to understand what the capabilities are compared to other packages like Plex, Kodi etc.

 

Thanks!

Edited July 5, 2017 by KaraokeAmerica

[Waldonnis 148]

Outside of MVC, I don't think frame sequential is supported by the server as a 3D file type, although it will probably play if the playback device can handle the frame rate (might require manually switching the monitor's 3D mode, assuming it supports it).  I have several frame-sequential files, but no 3D-capable monitors at this point, so I can't really test if it will work personally.  FSBS/FTAB, as well as HSBS/HTAB are definitely supported by the server and interface (just double-checked and all four are in the dropdown, along with MVC), as they are much more popular.

 

Honestly, not many playback devices or software support frame sequential playback in my experience (other than some projectors, which prefer it; FSBS/FTAB device support is even more scarce), so I'm not sure what you'll find when comparing Emby to other packages.  I know even Kodi's support for some 3D schemes is limited, which has always surprised me (check out the history of MVC support to get an idea).

[Swynol 375]

havent tried recently. But previously i setup an external player stereoscopic which when emby theater detects a 3D file it opens in the external player. I had to name the 3D file .mk3d 

 

all my 3D files are full 3D not SBS

[KaraokeAmerica 0]

Hmm.......I guess what I'm trying to see is whether I can rip a 3D BR in MakeMKV which is full-res 3D and Emby can play it through my LED panel. Ideally I'm looking for a solution that will play that same file in 2D or 3D requiring only one rip.

 

My knowledge of the various format terminologies may be lacking a bit.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Waldonnis 148]

Hmm.......I guess what I'm trying to see is whether I can rip a 3D BR in MakeMKV which is full-res 3D and Emby can play it through my LED panel. Ideally I'm looking for a solution that will play that same file in 2D or 3D requiring only one rip.

 

My knowledge of the various format terminologies may be lacking a bit.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

If your monitor/television can handle MVC files, then your MakeMKV rips should work just fine in Emby.  MVC is the 3D format used on nearly all 3D Blu-Rays, FYI.  It consists of the main video stream (often left-eye, but not always) and the MVC stream, which contains the right-eye information (represented kind of as a difference from the left eye frames, so it's not truly two independent streams).  MakeMKV will copy the MVC streams along with the main video stream, but make sure you select the MVC stream as well when you rip the disc...I don't think it's enabled using the default selection filter.

 

Be aware that rips straight from Blu-Ray will often have a higher bitrate, so make sure your network/television can handle it (most of my MVC files are around 36Mbit).

[KaraokeAmerica 0]

If your monitor/television can handle MVC files, then your MakeMKV rips should work just fine in Emby.  MVC is the 3D format used on nearly all 3D Blu-Rays, FYI.  It consists of the main video stream (often left-eye, but not always) and the MVC stream, which contains the right-eye information (represented kind of as a difference from the left eye frames, so it's not truly two independent streams).  MakeMKV will copy the MVC streams along with the main video stream, but make sure you select the MVC stream as well when you rip the disc...I don't think it's enabled using the default selection filter.

 

Be aware that rips straight from Blu-Ray will often have a higher bitrate, so make sure your network/television can handle it (most of my MVC files are around 36Mbit).

Thanks for the additional info. Is there an article or wiki on actual 3D options and operation?All I could find is the stuff about how to name the files.

 

It does seem from these responses that I have more to learn about 3D in general though. I am pretty adept at ripping to TAB/SBS and playing them through pretty much any player out there as they are still simply 1080, 2D rips with two frames. MVC/frame-sequential/frame-packed/etc are terms that I thought were essentially interchangeable. It seems they are not.

 

I have made MakeMKV rips to MKV using the prescribed tutorials I have found that include the MVC folder. I have yet to EVER play one in any software player that actually played in 3D on either of my 3D TV's.They just play in 2D. Is there any simple test that I can do to see if I can do this at all with my setup? Is there any single step Windows program like VLC that I can just play it on my HTPC to even confirm the file is right? In a perfect world such a setup could trigger my TV into switching to the proper 3D mode, but I'm willing to settle for baby steps.....

 

The ultimate HTPC solution for me will include:

 

- Single interface for ALL my media including live TV, music and of course movie in both 2D and 3D.

- For 3D I want the ability to rip one file (MVC for example) and have the option in that interface to play it in 3D or 2D without having to rip the same movie twice.

- DVR capability using my Silicon Dust tuners including OTA broadcast

- "Apps" to include the ability for my streaming services like Hulu, Amazon, Netflix, Sling etc and make them usable from within that same, single interface.

 

Yes, I am kind of looking for someone to "sell me" on Emby here.....

 

FTR: I never heard of Emby before last week when I was sitting in a bar outside Dallas and a guy was sitting next to me who had a few cocktails. He was trying to sell me on it and said that one of his friends was involved in the company somehow. Have no idea what the guy's name was but he couldn't answer the specific questions (especially 3D stuff) I was asking and referred me here to the website. He just kept carrying on about how awesome it was! I'm not cheap but I can be had!

 

Thanks for the feedback here!

Edited July 6, 2017 by KaraokeAmerica

[Jdiesel 1431]

I believe your options for 3D MVC are:

 

1. Emby Theater using madVR as the renderer

2. Emby Theater using an external player (Stereoscopic Player, PowerDVD, etc)

3. Kodi on Windows (MVC Build) with an Intel NUC using the Emby for Kodi plugin

4. Kodi on LibreELEC (Linux) with a RPi using the Emby for Kodi plugin

 

 

Your issue is going to be getting 3D MVC playback, Emby live TV, and streaming apps in a single package. Streaming apps on a HTPC are limited to a web browser and are clunky to use and take away from the on the couch remote control experience. Kodi (Emby for Kodi) doesn't currently interface with Emby's Live TV features very well but I hear there is working be done on this front. There is some very cutting edge work being done with Netflix/Amazon Prime streaming on Kodi right now (inputstream.adaptive) but it is tough to recommend for the average user and one should expect there to be issues and breakage. So there is really no all in one device. 

 

You also didn't mention your audio requirements. Do you need HD Audio (DTS-HD, Dolby TrueHD, etc)?

 

If 3D MVC playback is very important to you I recommend the RPi3 running LibreELEC and the Emby for Kodi plugin, it is hands down the best way to watch 3D movies. Only downside is that it is limited to 7.1 PCM audio so no Atmos or DTS:X. You could combine this with a Nvidia Shield TV, Xiaomi Mi box (No Amazon Prime I believe???), Fire TV, or Roku for all your other Emby and Streaming needs. The nice thing about Emby is that it keeps all your devices synced so you can easily jump from one to the next seamlessly.

 

Option two would be Emby Theater on a HTPC using madVR. There maybe some setup involved getting MVC working and I don't have specific details on which GPUs/Drivers work but I know it can be done. You could then get a Nvidia Shield TV, Xiaomi Mi box (No Amazon Prime I believe???), Fire TV, or Roku for all your streaming needs.  

 

Or if you decide that MVC maybe isn't that important to you and want to stick with SBS or OU 3D for your occasional 3D movie, get the Nvidia Shield and have it do everything and very well at that.

 

As you can see MVC is a bit of a pain. 3D never caught on in the home space and as such software support for it is very limited. There are a small group of users passionate about it but most have given up on that requirement due to the hassle it causes. If it were up to me I would go with the first option I mentioned, get a Nvidia Shield TV and use it as your main device for Emby and streaming apps. When you want to watch a MVC movie in 3D switch to the RPi running Kodi for that movie. I believe, please confirm yourself, that MVC movies will play in 2D on all hardware including the Shield TV therefore you can keep a single copy of the video and watch it in 2D on the Shield TV or 3D on the Rpi.

Edited July 6, 2017 by Jdiesel

[KaraokeAmerica 0]

I believe your options for 3D MVC are:

 

1. Emby Theater using madVR as the renderer

2. Emby Theater using an external player (Stereoscopic Player, PowerDVD, etc)

3. Kodi on Windows (MVC Build) with an Intel NUC using the Emby for Kodi plugin

4. Kodi on LibreELEC (Linux) with a RPi using the Emby for Kodi plugin

 

 

Your issue is going to be getting 3D MVC playback, Emby live TV, and streaming apps in a single package. Streaming apps on a HTPC are limited to a web browser and are clunky to use and take away from the on the couch remote control experience. Kodi (Emby for Kodi) doesn't currently interface with Emby's Live TV features very well but I hear there is working be done on this front. There is some very cutting edge work being done with Netflix/Amazon Prime streaming on Kodi right now (inputstream.adaptive) but it is tough to recommend for the average user and one should expect there to be issues and breakage. So there is really no all in one device. 

 

You also didn't mention your audio requirements. Do you need HD Audio (DTS-HD, Dolby TrueHD, etc)?

 

If 3D MVC playback is very important to you I recommend the RPi3 running LibreELEC and the Emby for Kodi plugin, it is hands down the best way to watch 3D movies. Only downside is that it is limited to 7.1 PCM audio so no Atmos or DTS:X. You could combine this with a Nvidia Shield TV, Xiaomi Mi box (No Amazon Prime I believe???), Fire TV, or Roku for all your other Emby and Streaming needs. The nice thing about Emby is that it keeps all your devices synced so you can easily jump from one to the next seamlessly.

 

Option two would be Emby Theater on a HTPC using madVR. There maybe some setup involved getting MVC working and I don't have specific details on which GPUs/Drivers work but I know it can be done. You could then get a Nvidia Shield TV, Xiaomi Mi box (No Amazon Prime I believe???), Fire TV, or Roku for all your streaming needs.  

 

Or if you decide that MVC maybe isn't that important to you and want to stick with SBS or OU 3D for your occasional 3D movie, get the Nvidia Shield and have it do everything and very well at that.

 

As you can see MVC is a bit of a pain. 3D never caught on in the home space and as such software support for it is very limited. There are a small group of users passionate about it but most have given up on that requirement due to the hassle it causes. If it were up to me I would go with the first option I mentioned, get a Nvidia Shield TV and use it as your main device for Emby and streaming apps. When you want to watch a MVC movie in 3D switch to the RPi running Kodi for that movie. I believe, please confirm yourself, that MVC movies will play in 2D on all hardware including the Shield TV therefore you can keep a single copy of the video and watch it in 2D on the Shield TV or 3D on the Rpi.

Well......EXCEPT for MVC I think this would do everything else I'm looking for:

 

https://www.roku.com/products/roku-ultra

 

It even supports Plex DVR now (no, I'm not trying to make this about Emby/vs/Plex. I'm trying to make it about a solution and I have been using Plex for a few years already):

 

https://www.plex.tv/apps/streaming-devices/roku/

 

But it still doesn't do 3D. That's the same issue with the NVidia Shield. It's like a unicorn bellybutton.....

 

What would a Shield do that the Roku won't for 1/2 to 1/3rd the price? I have an old Roku and it works fine, but it isn't really upgradable to modern standards. Is Shield superiority related to Emby support particularly? Does the Shield have a bunch more apps or something?

 

Audio isn't a major deal for me at this point. I have 5.1 currently and no Atmos etc. At some point I'll upgrade, but right now as long as I get sound I'm happy.....   I typically rip with default audio settings in Handbrake or CloneBD so no strict requirements there.

 

Yes, I am sticking with TAB/SBS until a better solution exists, but doing that necessitates double rips for 2D and 3D. It's also technically half the resolution although on my 4K TV that technicality is largely mitigated visually by upscaling with 1080 content.

 

I actually just looked at Pi's at Fry's today. I have toyed with trying them for about a year now. I have heard disaster stories about LibreELEC though. Friends that are geekier than me say it's a horrible OS. I get it's only intended to be a one trick pony but it doesn't even have a shut down option. What's really shocking to me is that with all the HTPC software packages out there like Kodi, Emby, Plex etc, that NOBODY has picked up the reins on full-res 3D. Generally only geeks do HTPC and plenty of us want total geek with 3D. Kodi will do it (supposedly) but only on the LibreELEC/Pi platform which  doesn't really help me with all the other stuff I need.

 

There are some boxed like the Popcorn etc that are HTPC solutions, but they don't do everything. They can just play about any media you throw at it like 3D, but it leaves me hanging on many other things like single interface, DVR etc.

 

Frustrating.....

[Jdiesel 1431]

A couple differences between the Shield TV and Roku that come to mind:

 

-Shield has support for refresh rate switching (24p playback for smooth motion)

-Android app ecosystems is much larger

-Android TV has a nicer UI (IMO)

-Shield TV supports HD audio

-Shield TV supports light gaming if you desire

-Shield supports more video/audio codec therefore decreases the likelihood of the server needing to transcode

 

Other than that they both do a pretty good job. I also own several Roku's myself.

 

 

I get that people have different opinions on Kodi/LibreELEC but in my experience it is rock solid stable and is pretty much set it and forget it. It is meant to be a media player and nothing more so if you want to start adding more services and trying to customize it too much your results may vary. Also I am positive that it does have a shut down option although some third party skins may not have it exposed.

 

I personally think that 3D content will disappear in the next 2-3 years. All TV manufactures has discontinued 3D support in the 2017 models leaving only projectors with 3D support. The industry has moved on to 4K and HDR as a means to get people to update their hardware. Unfortunately 3D and more specifically MVC is a niche market and I doubt we are likely to see much advancement in that area. 

Edited July 6, 2017 by Jdiesel

[KaraokeAmerica 0]

A couple differences between the Shield TV and Roku that come to mind:

 

-Shield has support for refresh rate switching (24p playback for smooth motion)

-Android app ecosystems is much larger

-Android TV has a nicer UI (IMO)

-Shield TV supports HD audio

-Shield TV supports light gaming if you desire

-Shield supports more video/audio codec therefore decreases the likelihood of the server needing to transcode

 

Other than that they both do a pretty good job. I also own several Roku's myself.

 

 

I get that people have different opinions on Kodi/LibreELEC but in my experience it is rock solid stable and is pretty much set it and forget it. It is meant to be a media player and nothing more so if you want to start adding more services and trying to customize it too much your results may vary. Also I am positive that it does have a shut down option although some third party skins may not have it exposed.

 

I personally think that 3D content will disappear in the next 2-3 years. All TV manufactures has discontinued 3D support in the 2017 models leaving only projectors with 3D support. The industry has moved on to 4K and HDR as a means to get people to update their hardware. Unfortunately 3D and more specifically MVC is a niche market and I doubt we are likely to see much advancement in that area. 

I have been hearing about the demise of 3D for a few years now. It's true that no flat panels makers support it anymore, but look at all the movies that STILL get released to theaters in 3D AND subsequently released on home video in 3D. Somebody is consuming that stuff. I'm one of them. I don't own a projector which still has 3D models, but if I have to to consume 3D I will and both my 3D LED's blow up.

 

Some would say that it's becoming a "theater only" experience but given the fact that pretty much everything that comes out in 3D at the theater is also being released in 3D on home video I'm not sure why folks think that. The notable holdout was Star Wars - TFA which came out in 3D at the theater, but was not offered that way up on initial home video release. They waited until the following Christmas season to release the 3D "directors cut" edition that was 3D. Let's be real though.....that was about marketing, not lack of demand. They wanted to sell it twice.

 

I appreciate the feedback on the devices. At this point I'm leaning towards the Roku because (since I'm not a gamer) the main advantage for my needs is HD Audio and frankly, that's not worth $100 more to me. I listen in whatever audio I can get now and since my system is 5.1 (and old) I'm not missing anything there.

 

Frankly, if it weren't for 4K I'd probably just buy another Firestick and call it soup!