OT: My windows 8 upgrade hell

[crashkelly 62]

Hey all, this is more of a vent and hopefully a shot at getting suggestions

 

I have an Asrock Vision 3D Sandy Bridge HTPC that was previously running windows 8 without issue. Over the last couple of weeks I have taken everything off that machine, MB3, DVDFab, AnyDVD, ..... and moved all of it to a second machine so that I could dedicate the HTPC to what is was intended for, watching media.

 

I had the bright idea on Saturday to re-install the OS from scratch to get rid of anything that was left lying around and start out clean. Using exactly the same disk I used the first time I upgrade, that was a clean install as well, I did a clean install of windows 8, included a reformat of the OS drive.

 

The install completed, I set up my account, and after the setup screens, I saw my "Metro" screen for about 3 seconds and then I got the " :(" and was told there was an unhandled exception and the machine would reboot. It then went into a cycle of that until I turned the system off.

 

A bit irritated, I started all over again to end up at exactly the same place after another clean install, and then another

 

Moving into detective mode I started to try to eliminate possible sources. I looked up the actual error message, which unfortunately escapes me at the moment as I am sitting at the Kia dealership getting my winter tires installed, and found that most of the information surrounded the onboard Intel graphics driver. Again, I had previously done this exact install with this exact disk and did not have an issue.

 

I then tried a clean install again, without any internet connectivity, and managed to get it installed to the point that I could update the Intel  graphics driver, but during the install of that driver I got the same error message and the htpc went into the same reboot cycle.

 

I then started again, but this time I switched out the hard drive for another just in case somehow it was that but after a another clean install I ended up in the same place as before.

 

The next attempt I managed to get it going and after a few error reboots I access the boot menu and restarted it in safe mode and was able to install the original graphics driver that came with the system, it was intended for Win7, and after rebooting I thought I had it but it only lasted about 5 minutes before the "SYSTEM_THREAD_EXCEPTION" error came up. That was the error I was getting from the beginning but I just remembered it

 

After 2 days of beating my head against the wall I am at a complete loss of what to do or try and am at a point where I am going to move back to Win7 so I can get my htpc back up and running. Worst part is that after the OS install there is next to no time to try to diagnose anything with the system as it just goes into the reboot cycle.

 

If anyone has any ideas I would be more than happy to post more information.

 

Thanks

[mboehler 94]

I'm no help with upgrading to Windows 8, but I would suggest just leaving Windows 7 on there.  If you're only going to use it as an HTPC, you will rarely see the Windows interface anyway.

 

Personally, I like Windows 7 better than 8 anyway.  Although that may be because I never had a chance to get used to it.

[CBers 7450]

@@crashkelly - I had similar issues on a PC earlier this year. Did you Disable UEFI and Enable Legacy Boot ??

 

You might wanna Google "Disable UEFI and Enable Legacy Boot", as it seems after an initial install, something is set somewhere in UEFI that trashes subsequent installs.

 

I'm no help with upgrading to Windows 8, but I would suggest just leaving Windows 7 on there.  If you're only going to use it as an HTPC, you will rarely see the Windows interface anyway.

 

Personally, I like Windows 7 better than 8 anyway.  Although that may be because I never had a chance to get used to it.

 

I bought a brand new Dell XPS PC earlier this year that came with Windows 8.

 

As soon as I switched it on, I installed Windows 7 onto it instead.

 

Even with the expected 8.1 update I still don't like Windows 8 as much as Windows 7.

Edited November 5, 2013 by CBers

[trooper11 63]

You said 8 had been running fine on the system, did you do an upgrade from Win 7 to 8 or was that a clean install?

 

There are a couple of options  I would try.

 

First, you could install Windows 7 and then perform an upgrade to 8 

 

Second, you could try installing with an 8.1 iso instead of your 8 disc. There is a method floating around to do this, so I'll post a link if you want to try that.

 

CBers brings up a good point about the UEFI issue.  I have seen others report that problem, so its definitely worth checking into.

Edited November 5, 2013 by trooper11

[crashkelly 62]

@mboehler: I hear you on the interface stuff, right now it is a matter of "It worked before, why won't it work now" and the fact that it is a computer, it will not beat me

 

@CBers: I have not read up on the UEFI stuff, but I will and give that a go

 

@trooper11: I had read about the 8.1 ISO but it had said that you can't do a clean install from it. Would be appreciated if you could post the link on how to how to get it done. The original time it was running 8 it was a clean install. I am considering looking at the win7 to 8 upgrade, but only as a last resort as I prefer the clean install method, but it is getting to the "whatever works" point.

 

Thanks all for your suggestions. I will let you know how it goes

 

Cheers

Edited November 5, 2013 by crashkelly

[trooper11 63]

Alright, here is a link to instruction on how to use an 8.1 ISO to do a full install and not require a product key during installation:

 

http://www.jmedved.com/2013/09/installing-windows-8-1-or-8-without-a-product-key/

 

The product key bit is there because 8.0 keys are not currently working when you try to use them during a clean install of 8.1. This method allows you to put in your 8.0 key after it is installed and it will accept the key at that point.

 

Its a bit lengthy, but the method does work and its something MS has documented.

 

Its just strange that you did a clean install before and it went fine. Nothing has changed with your hardware or the 8.0 install disc between then and now, so that's why I'm wondering if it could be something in the bios/uefi that has changed. That's the only thing that could have changed and survived a windows clean install, so definitely investigate those settings.

[crashkelly 62]

@@trooper11

 

Thanks for the link, I will check it out tonight.

 

That is the part that gets me. Absolutely nothing has changed on the system from the previous time I successfully installed. It is a pre-built htpc from ASRock and other than the space for a second laptop size drive, there really is nothing you can change as the bits are stuffed in there like sardines in a can.

 

I will be checking through the BIOS stuff tonight.

 

Thanks again

[Nelcruz 3]

I had a similar problem. To solve, I disconnected all hard drives, took out all cards and during the install process formatted the drive. Worked for me.

[crashkelly 62]

@@Nelcruz

 

Thanks for the suggestion. Unfortunately on my HTPC the only things to disconnect are the hard drive and bd ROM. Have already tried swapping drives but it made no difference.

 

Cheers 

[crashkelly 62]

Well, I think it has beaten me. 5 days of trying to get windows 8 onto this machine, again, and I am no further ahead than I was when the first BSOD occurred. I think I have re-installed Win8 25 times, tried UEFI suggestions that were mentioned, tried newer drivers, tried older drivers, ...........

 

The only thing I have not tried is a straight Win8.1 install, but I have no reason to believe it will be any different.

 

I am going to re-install Win7 and leave it at that for now

 

BSOD have left me blue

 

Thanks to all who took the time to try to help, it is appreciated

 

Cheers

[jordy 284]

just out of curiosity, have you tried installing a dedicated graphics card - if the error seems to be related to the graphics driver - it may be a hardware issue. Installing a dedicated graphics card may overcome that. Worth a try if you have one handy...

[crashkelly 62]

just out of curiosity, have you tried installing a dedicated graphics card - if the error seems to be related to the graphics driver - it may be a hardware issue. Installing a dedicated graphics card may overcome that. Worth a try if you have one handy...

 

Hey jordy and thanks for your reply. The htpc does have a dedicated graphics card, NVIDIA^® GeForce GT540M Graphics (with 1GB GDDR3 VRAM). I have hunted through everything on the system and I cannot find any way to disable the onboard Intel^® HD Graphics 3000 chip. I have tried the Lucid Virtu software and turned it off through there but generally as soon as I reboot I get the BSOD again.

 

Last night I reinstalled Win7 and all the drivers that come with the system. Then proceeded to do all the available windows updates, except the available Intel graphics driver updates. Once I had all of the windows updates in place I proceeded to install the Intel driver updates via windows update. The first time around the system crashed and on a reboot it restored itself to the previous driver. The second go around the new driver installed but upon reboot I had the yellow warning icon on the Intel HD Graphics 3000 item in device manager. Upon looking in the properties the error is related to Windows not being able to verify the digital signature. I rolled back the driver to the original that came with the system and the warning icon went away.

 

Original driver version is 8.15.10.2372

Windows update driver is 9.17.10.2932

Latest from Intel is 9.17.10.3223

 

I had tried the 9.17.10.3223 when working with Win8 but that driver gave me a system service exception and never successfully booted into Windows.

 

At this point I am considering an in-place update to Win8 but I do not hold out much hope for it being any different than previous attempts at a clean install

 

Cheers

[Yogi 367]

With all the systems I have had the best way to disable the onboard graphics is via the bios,I presume you have already tried this.

[crashkelly 62]

With all the systems I have had the best way to disable the onboard graphics is via the bios,I presume you have already tried this.

 

For sure, well attempted to anyway as I cannot find anywhere in the BIOS to do it and I have hunted every corner of the BIOS multiple times

 

Cheers

[trooper11 63]

For sure, well attempted to anyway as I cannot find anywhere in the BIOS to do it and I have hunted every corner of the BIOS multiple times

 

Cheers

That is strange that you can't disable it via the bios.

 

From the sound of it, there is something going on in relation to the onboard graphics. Even your Win 7 install wasn't smooth due to it.

 

Maybe the latest drive is the problem. You could go and get the previous version of it when you try to upgrade to 8.

[crashkelly 62]

That is strange that you can't disable it via the bios.

 

From the sound of it, there is something going on in relation to the onboard graphics. Even your Win 7 install wasn't smooth due to it.

 

Maybe the latest drive is the problem. You could go and get the previous version of it when you try to upgrade to 8.

 

That was pretty much. The install of Win7 went fine and so did all of the updates. Things only hit the crapper when I tried to update the onboard graphics video driver. When I rolled back the updated driver to the original that came with the system everything was fine again.

 

I believe that the screwy driver that I upgraded to for Win7 is the same driver that installs with the OS when installing Win8 and in the case of the latter install, installing the driver that came with the system does not fix things so I guess there is updated version of something going in the system on Win 8 install that is there to support the updated driver.

 

Did that make sense?

 

I think I am going to image the Win 7 drive as it is now, working , and try in-place update to Win8

 

Cheers

[Lee 212]

if you upgrade - when you get 8 on you can go

charms>settings>change pc settings>update&recovery >recovery>

Remove everything and reinstall windows.

that will give you virtually a clean install opposed to upgrade status with leftover rubbish....

[CashMoney 94]

This is off the top of my head, and off the top of my head I don't believe it relates to the HD3000 at all but ...

 

During the Win 8 preview, they had an Intel driver for older Intel gfx chipsets available that supported the new WDDM at version 1.0. They then removed it for the final product requiring you to have a gfx chip driver that supported WDDM 1.1. To get around it, folks were installing the Win7 driver in compatibility mode. This was the only way I could get Win 8 to work on an old Netbook (yes I know, it was a curiosity install ... that said, it worked quite well surprisingly). Interestingly, I've since tried 8.1 and said "preview" driver appears to be back (but since the Windows store now requires you to have a minimum horizontal resolution of no less than 768, I can't open it. Again, curiosity install so not an issue for me).

 

Again, I don't think this relates to the HD3000 series but to older chipsets, the GM450 etc. However, you mentioned you've not tried 8.1 as yet, but if it is in anyway related, perhaps you'll have better luck going directly to 8.1.

[crashkelly 62]

if you upgrade - when you get 8 on you can go

charms>settings>change pc settings>update&recovery >recovery>

Remove everything and reinstall windows.

that will give you virtually a clean install opposed to upgrade status with leftover rubbish....

 

I have tried about 2 dozen clean installs and always ended up with the system exception thread error. I am hoping the an in-place upgrade might leave something in-place that will get things working.

 

This is off the top of my head, and off the top of my head I don't believe it relates to the HD3000 at all but ...

 

During the Win 8 preview, they had an Intel driver for older Intel gfx chipsets available that supported the new WDDM at version 1.0. They then removed it for the final product requiring you to have a gfx chip driver that supported WDDM 1.1. To get around it, folks were installing the Win7 driver in compatibility mode. This was the only way I could get Win 8 to work on an old Netbook (yes I know, it was a curiosity install ... that said, it worked quite well surprisingly). Interestingly, I've since tried 8.1 and said "preview" driver appears to be back (but since the Windows store now requires you to have a minimum horizontal resolution of no less than 768, I can't open it. Again, curiosity install so not an issue for me).

 

Again, I don't think this relates to the HD3000 series but to older chipsets, the GM450 etc. However, you mentioned you've not tried 8.1 as yet, but if it is in anyway related, perhaps you'll have better luck going directly to 8.1.

 

I was just reading my instruction manual, yes it has gotten that bad , and the motherboard says it has quicksync but it is only for Win 7. I am going to try turning it off before the win8 upgrade and see what happens.

 

Thanks for all the info

 

Cheers

[trooper11 63]

Yeah I think doing an image and then trying the in place upgrade is a good thing to try next.

 

Based on what you said, it does sound like there is some driver issue that was introduced with the latest intel driver. That issue affects Win 7, but its even worse with Win 8, so some combination of things is making it worse.

 

If an in place upgrade to 8 does not work, maybe going straight to 8.1 is worth a try.

[crashkelly 62]

Yeah I think doing an image and then trying the in place upgrade is a good thing to try next.

 

Based on what you said, it does sound like there is some driver issue that was introduced with the latest intel driver. That issue affects Win 7, but its even worse with Win 8, so some combination of things is making it worse.

 

If an in place upgrade to 8 does not work, maybe going straight to 8.1 is worth a try.

 

I hear you on that

[jordy 284]

This might be a dumb question, but have you installed the (latest) drivers for your GT540M? I believe that if you install a dedicated graphics card on a system with inbuilt graphics, then the card takes precedence - automatically disabling the on board chip. It did when i installed a nVidia GT560 into my Asus P8H77-M, i7 w/HD3000on-board graphics. I never had to turn anything off, just install the GT560 drivers. Anyway, good luck finding a solution.

 

Just thought, I should mention that i'm staying on W7x64 Ult. Don't like W8 at all

Edited November 8, 2013 by jordy

[Scott84Z28 39]

If you have Win7 working, can you then in the Device Manager disable the on-board video device?  And then try the Win8 upgrade?   I'm not sure if the device will stay disable, or if it will try to re-enable it and update the drivers during the OS upgrade process.   Which motherboard do you have exactly?

[crashkelly 62]

This might be a dumb question, but have you installed the (latest) drivers for your GT540M? I believe that if you install a dedicated graphics card on a system with inbuilt graphics, then the card takes precedence - automatically disabling the on board chip. It did when i installed a nVidia GT560 into my Asus P8H77-M, i7 w/HD3000on-board graphics. I never had to turn anything off, just install the GT560 drivers. Anyway, good luck finding a solution.

 

Just thought, I should mention that i'm staying on W7x64 Ult. Don't like W8 at all

 

I am still on the original GT540M that came with the system as I have yet to research the newer ones. The first time around with Win8 on this machine I did grab the newest drivers but did not get the Vision 3D package and therefore never had 3D so I reverted to the original package. Always intend to look at moving up but then I got caught by this

 

If you have Win7 working, can you then in the Device Manager disable the on-board video device?  And then try the Win8 upgrade?   I'm not sure if the device will stay disable, or if it will try to re-enable it and update the drivers during the OS upgrade process.   Which motherboard do you have exactly?

 

Been there done that with the device manager, not in Win 7 but when I had Win8 on it. The system seemed to ignore the fact that the graphics unit was disabled and the error still occurred.

 

To be honest, I have no idea what motherboard I have. I have been trying to find that for days but it does not seem to be anywhere, or I am a dumbass and keep looking right past it.

 

Going to more on this more tonight. Thanks for both of your replies

 

Cheers

[crashkelly 62]

Shhhhhhh .... the Intel graphic chip might hear you ....... shhhhhhhhhhh