Is there an Installer outside from the MS Store?

[tuaris 5]

Where can I download without having to use the Windows store?

[softworkz 5066]

5 minutes ago, tuaris said:

Where can I download without having to use the Windows store?

Go here: https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9nblggh4t70l?hl=en-US&gl=US

Cliick on "Download" to download an exe installer.

[tuaris 5]

9 minutes ago, softworkz said:

Go here: https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9nblggh4t70l?hl=en-US&gl=US

Cliick on "Download" to download an exe installer.

I did try that but that fails.  Probably because I block all access to the Microsoft store.  I was hoping for an actual non-store installer related exe.

[softworkz 5066]

8 minutes ago, tuaris said:

I was hoping for an actual non-store installer related exe.

There is no such thing. It's a Windows app which again relies on Windows components, which are distributed and updated in the same way.

The MS store is not such evil as some are thinking. Especially when they are complaining about the MS Store but using Google products at the same time..

[tuaris 5]

1 minute ago, softworkz said:

There is no such thing. It's a Windows app which again relies on Windows components, which are distributed and updated in the same way.

The MS store is not such evil as some are thinking. Especially when they are complaining about the MS Store but using Google products at the same time..

I'm sure it's okay, but it's fine.  I just prefer to use Windows the traditional way without app stores.  No worries, I can live without it.

Since you support FreeBSD as server platform, there's nothing the Emby team could do to upset me 

[softworkz 5066]

41 minutes ago, tuaris said:

I just prefer to use Windows the traditional way without app stores.

Same did I. And I still do generally. But in case of the MS Store, it's MSIX packages, a successor to MSI installers. They are just zips that you can extract and inspect easily (unlike MSI).
And we are the ones to create those MSIX packages. We submit them to MS - and all they do is adding a signature - they do not change any content. So what you get from the store is our MSIX - created by us. What they provide is the automatic (or manual if you choose so) updating - in a safe and convenient way - for us and the users.

The MSIX installation of the app is per-user. This means that no elevation is required when you install it - so you don't need to deeply trust us like you need to do when instlalling something the "traditional way". Almost all of those installers require elevation - and be honest: How many times have you just blindly agreed to elevate for an installation where you knew nothing about the devloper/company from where it came?

Google Chrome for example has a "traditional" exe installer. Do you know what it does on installation? It installs a system service named ".... Elevation Service" and a scheduled task (several actually) which have the primary purpose to allow Chrome perform actions which would require your consent (to elevate) - without your consent. And when you disable these and you update manually, then it is resetting your changes and enable all this again. They are pushing browser updates without asking and you cannot easiily disable it. When you see "Restart to update..." the update has already happened. 
Having these elevation services on millions of machines all over the world, puts Google into a position that they could take control over all those machines at once - they just need to push an update - which can act with admin privileges on all those computers.

On the otther side - with the MS Store:

• You can be sure that we aren't able to run any privileged operation in a software update
• The installation itself doesn't require elevation
• You have control whether to have apps updated manually or automatically
• The update mechanism isn't a potential backdoor to your system

Which way do you find better?

 

Edited September 20, 2025 by softworkz

[tuaris 5]

2 hours ago, softworkz said:

in case of the MS Store, it's MSIX packages, a successor to MSI installers. They are just zips that you can extract and inspect easily (unlike MSI).
And we are the ones to create those MSIX packages. We submit them to MS - and all they do is adding a signature - they do not change any content. So what you get from the store is our MSIX - created by us. What they provide is the automatic (or manual if you choose so) updating - in a safe and convenient way - for us and the users.

Interesting, thanks for the explanation. I didn't care enough about them to actually do any research, so I appreciate the quick intro to it.

2 hours ago, softworkz said:

Which way do you find better?

I'll keep an open mind.  Maybe I'll give this them try.  I just need to remember all the group policies and DNS entries I put in place to block these Windows store apps 

Edited September 20, 2025 by tuaris

[softworkz 5066]

11 hours ago, tuaris said:

I just need to remember all the group policies and DNS entries I put in place to block these Windows store apps

Open group policy. Right-click "Administrative Templates" and select "Filter Options". Choose "Yes" for "Configured", leave others at "Any". Then, in the tree, click on "All settings".
Then you'll see all your changes - both for "Computer Confguration" and "User Configuration".

DNS blocks: %WINDIR%\System32\drivers\etc\hosts

[softworkz 5066]

11 hours ago, tuaris said:

Interesting, thanks for the explanation. I didn't care enough about them to actually do any research, so I appreciate the quick intro to it.

I'm responding in detail, because I used to have the same feelings about it and I also have loads of Group Policy entries to prevent things I don't want to happen.

But regarding app installation, we need to realize that the world has massively changed over the past decade. Malicious actors are no longer just kids trying out bad things for fun, to see how far they can get, but are well organized, professional and often even funded by governments. And those actors are systematically seeking for all kinds of security holes through which they can get access to other systems.

In the past - with "traditional installers", you either let it up to users to update an installed application - or developers "invented" their own auto-update mechanisms. But the truth is, that most often, such home-grown updaters are flawed in terms of security and serve as a welcome target for attackers. Those attackers just need to break into the server from which updates are auto-installed in order to spread some malware to all the machines on which software is installed. 
All software you install which has an integrated auto-update implementation is a potential entry-point for malware. And it's just natural that a software developer/company who has just finished their product with lots of hard word, won't have the time and diligence when their last task before publishing is to build an auto-update mechanism - they'll usually just want to get something working quickly without taking care about implications in terms of security.

When you see that situation as a whole and from a distance - you can reasonably come to a single conclusion only:

    It would be much better when there's a common update mechanism for applications on Windows which software developers can use

The answer to that is the Microsoft Store. Initially, it was limited to UWP (Universal Windows) apps, also targeting Windows phone and other platforms and they wanted to play a lot like Google - which had failed eventually. But meanwhile they have totally overhauled it, removed Google-style features like ad-based monetization and opened the store for other kinds of apps. Above I had said that they don't change the packages - which is true - but what they do is a deep  analysis of the code and code changes when new versions are submitted, and all apps and app updates are installed and tested by a human before getting published to the store - so even when somebody would steal our credentials for submitting apps to the store, they would have a hard time to include any malware in an app update. 

As a matter of fact: The MS Store is by far the safest way for installing and updating applications on Windows.
 

One requirement is that we must be able to frequently update the inner-app code, so that we can deliver bugs and new features smoothly and don't need to deal with many different versions when users are reporting issues (which might already be fixed in newer versions). The legacy Emby Theater app was rarely updated, but it loaded the inner-app (html/js UI) code from an external server via http - not even https, because then it wouldn't have been able to access Emby servers without SSL setup (like in the local network).
This is not only highly insecure but also not the way how I would like an app to work: I want it to include all its code locally and not be dependent on any online connection where the code that is run locally is coming from a remote site.

 

Summing Up

The new Emby Windows app has all of its code included, distribution of updates via the Microsoft Store is the most secure, trustable, reliable and efficient way for us and all Emby users. I can very well understand when people have reservations about it, as it requires a deeper look and understanding to come to an educated assessment,

Yet I can say that I fully stand behind this choice and I'm also confident that acceptance will increase even more over time.
 

[Houfino 41]

I don't agree that Microsoft Store is better. That's a lie. It seems like you have no respect for people and act like you're smart. We just want to be able to choose Microsoft Store and install programs (exe).

 

Please think!!! Sometimes people have trouble accessing the Microsoft Store due to blocking, Windows Update failures, system corruption, etc. For example: I turned off Windows Update, so the Microsoft Store won't let me continue until I turn updates back on. So why are you forcing us to use the Microsoft Store? That's not freedom, we have the right to choose what we want. We live in a democracy, not communism.

 

 

[Luke 42077]

1 hour ago, Houfino said:

I don't agree that Microsoft Store is better. That's a lie. It seems like you have no respect for people and act like you're smart. We just want to be able to choose Microsoft Store and install programs (exe).

 

Please think!!! Sometimes people have trouble accessing the Microsoft Store due to blocking, Windows Update failures, system corruption, etc. For example: I turned off Windows Update, so the Microsoft Store won't let me continue until I turn updates back on. So why are you forcing us to use the Microsoft Store? That's not freedom, we have the right to choose what we want. We live in a democracy, not communism.

 

 

HI, would a packaged version of the store download help? Similar to how we publish the aok's for android?

It will still require the store to be operational on your windows machine, so there's no getting around that.

[Mahinepua 81]

6 hours ago, Houfino said:

We live in a democracy, not communism.

 

 

Emby is not a democracy, its a commercial entity.

We can provide feedback but ultimately its their decision how to package software and we can choose whether or not to purchase their products.

[softworkz 5066]

21 hours ago, Houfino said:

We live in a democracy, not communism.

Want this to be a democracy?

Gazillions(*) of users have installed the app meanwhile, so their vote is clear. Less than a dozen of users have complained about it so far.

So, as for a democracy - the votes are very clear.

(*) replace by a very large number with lots of zeros