Convert Multi-Channel AAC/FLAC

[legierk 8]

This setting is on my Emby App for Roku. Works great and I love what it does. Why is this setting not on my Emby App for Windows/XBox? Or, more specifically, is it there and I just can't find it?

Edited December 8, 2024 by softworkz
Fixed casing

[Guest]

For the Windows app, you'll need the ac3 encoder. It was something I suggested... @softworkz

[legierk 8]

Thanks. It's just weird that all the apps for different platforms are a little different. Will this ac3 encoder be added in the new version presumably being released "soon"? I keep seeing posts about it but no date yet.

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, legierk said:

Thanks. It's just weird that all the apps for different platforms are a little different. Will this ac3 encoder be added in the new version presumably being released "soon"? I keep seeing posts about it but no date yet.

I've tagged softworkz. He'll need to answer if he intends to add it. A lot of people like/want it, and it's easy to add, so we'll see what he says...

[Luke 42077]

Hi yes we can look at adding this option to more apps. Thanks for the feedback.

[softworkz 5066]

On 12/5/2024 at 3:58 AM, generiq said:

For the Windows app, you'll need the ac3 encoder. It was something I suggested... @softworkz

There's no ac3 encoder needed. MPV can output multi-channel uncompressed audio over HDMI which provides much better quality than AC3.

[softworkz 5066]

On 12/5/2024 at 1:26 AM, legierk said:

This setting is on my Emby App for Roku. Works great and I love what it does. Why is this setting not on my Emby App for Windows/XBox? Or, more specifically, is it there and I just can't find it?

This should not be needed as we can output uncompressed multi-channel audio via HDMI. Just choose your speaker layout in the settings:

 

Here's an example for a video with 6-channel AAC audio:

 

And the MPV log showing the negotiation the TV audio output:

 

The Xbox does the same btw. This also obsoletes the need for AC3-passthrough and all muilti-channel audio formats which ffmpeg can decode. It only makes sense for formats it cannot decode like Atmos or the high-end DTS formats.

 

[Guest]

44 minutes ago, softworkz said:

There's no ac3 encoder needed. MPV can output multi-channel uncompressed audio over HDMI which provides much better quality than AC3.

That's not what he wants. The requirement is output to Dolby (AC3), converting AAC/FLAC multi-channel audio to AC3.

He may have optical audio.

I've already shown you the need for this.

When the new app replaces the existing app, the people that have added the AC3 encoder in their mpv.conf because they have optical audio output, will be at a loss.

[softworkz 5066]

17 minutes ago, generiq said:

The requirement is output to Dolby (AC3), converting AAC/FLAC multi-channel audio to AC3.

He may have optical audio.

The screenshot is from the Roku app and Roku devices don't have optical outputs afaik.

[legierk 8]

Everything I have is connected via HDMI. Roku, XBox, Windows PC. But, I do not have those settings on my Windows/XBox Emby Theater App. That looks like Beta. I have 3.0.20 or something like that. I also have the Windows Store App, and it too, is different than the Windows Desktop App, but neither have those settings that you show in the screenshot. (unless I am missing them in the menu?)

 

Edit: One other thing I'd like to point out... Windows has settings similiar to those....where you set the speaker configuration. My experience is that that is a global setting. In other words, it affects all codecs/encodings...whatever the correct term is. What I like about the Roku setting (in the first screenshot I shared) is that it is ONLY for AAC/FLAC multichannel. Everything else is Passthrough. Of course, this is only an issue because no AVR (Denon reciever in my case) will decode AAC.

Edited December 6, 2024 by legierk

[Guest]

The Windows audio channel config has to match the mpv channel layout. If you select 5.1 in Theater but Windows is set to stereo, everything will come out stereo. But not if you use the AC3 encoder. As that will use passthrough. 

Edited December 6, 2024 by generiq

[yocker 1247]

12 hours ago, softworkz said:

This should not be needed as we can output uncompressed multi-channel audio via HDMI. Just choose your speaker layout in the settings:

 

 

Wish there was something similar to this for Android, having problems with 7.1 being played as 2.0.

[softworkz 5066]

On 12/6/2024 at 8:40 PM, generiq said:

The Windows audio channel config has to match the mpv channel layout.

No, it doesn't have to match. These are two very different things.

Windows Channel Configuration

This controls the channel configuration that is used in shared (= non-exclusive ) mode.
It can be different for each audio device. This means that for each audio device you should configure it according to the actual configuration you have (which speakers are connected) - just the way it is intended to be used by Windows.

The Channel Configuration in Emby (MPV)

This one defines a preference for how you want MPV to deliver the audio to the Windows Audio API. It does use this value in a way that it goes through all formats that are available for outputting audio and chooses the closest match.

• If Exclusive Mode is enabled
  • It will choose the closest available audio format (channels layout) from the audio device 
  • and actually put the audio device into that mode - no matter what you have chosen for the Windows channel configuration!
• In Shared Mode (Exclusive Mode disabled)
  • The audio API may still offer multi-channel audio layouts for apps to send audio - even if the Windows channel layout is different
  • MPV player chooses the closest matching format according to the configuration
  • But Windows will then downmix the audio to the channel layout that you have configured in Windows audio settings

So, if for example you are frequently switching between PC audio and audio on a connected TV, you may just leave the layout in Emby settings at 5.1, so that you get 5.1 audio in case of TV output and when the audio is set to PC audio, you still get it downmixed by Windows (if it's set to Stereo for example), no need to change to 2-channel in Emby settings in that case, it will work.

PS: For best quality, you might still want to enable exclusive audio mode and set Stereo in Emby options.

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, softworkz said:

No, it doesn't have to match. These are two very different things.

Windows Channel Configuration

This controls the channel configuration that is used in shared (= non-exclusive ) mode.
It can be different for each audio device. This means that for each audio device you should configure it according to the actual configuration you have (which speakers are connected) - just the way it is intended to be used by Windows.

The Channel Configuration in Emby (MPV)

This one defines a preference for how you want MPV to deliver the audio to the Windows Audio API. It does use this value in a way that it goes through all formats that are available for outputting audio and chooses the closest match.

• If Exclusive Mode is enabled
  • It will choose the closest available audio format (channels layout) from the audio device 
  • and actually put the audio device into that mode - no matter what you have chosen for the Windows channel configuration!
• In Shared Mode (Exclusive Mode disabled)
  • The audio API may still offer multi-channel audio layouts for apps to send audio - even if the Windows channel layout is different
  • MPV player chooses the closest matching format according to the configuration
  • But Windows will then downmix the audio to the channel layout that you have configured in Windows audio settings

So, if for example you are frequently switching between PC audio and audio on a connected TV, you may just leave the layout in Emby settings at 5.1, so that you get 5.1 audio in case of TV output and when the audio is set to PC audio, you still get it downmixed by Windows (if it's set to Stereo for example), no need to change to 2-channel in Emby settings in that case, it will work.

PS: For best quality, you might still want to enable exclusive audio mode and set Stereo in Emby options.

Something has changed then. I always had to do that. If I had Windows at stereo, it would always be stereo. I can't test that anymore, and that was with Windows 10.

[softworkz 5066]

16 minutes ago, generiq said:

If I had Windows at stereo, it would always be stereo

Where's the contradiction? You mean even in exclusive mode? Or you mean the setting applied to all audio devices?

It's also possible that for certain audio devices the channel setting also applies to exclusive audio mode - which makes sense for example in case of on-board audio where the channel setup also determines which of the plugs are serving which purpose (i.e. which is rear-left, rear-right, sub and center). In that case it doesn't make sense when it can be overriden in exclusive audio mode.

Before writing, I had made a number of tests, and for example when I configured the HDMI audio for the TV to stereo, I got stereo output in shared mode, but 5.1 (uncompressed) in exclusive mode.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, softworkz said:

Where's the contradiction? You mean even in exclusive mode? Or you mean the setting applied to all audio devices?

It's also possible that for certain audio devices the channel setting also applies to exclusive audio mode - which makes sense for example in case of on-board audio where the channel setup also determines which of the plugs are serving which purpose (i.e. which is rear-left, rear-right, sub and center). In that case it doesn't make sense when it can be overriden in exclusive audio mode.

Before writing, I had made a number of tests, and for example when I configured the HDMI audio for the TV to stereo, I got stereo output in shared mode, but 5.1 (uncompressed) in exclusive mode.

I had several AV receivers. 7.1.2 setup. If Windows audio was configured to stereo, regardless of what channel config I set in mpv, it was always downmixed to stereo. I haven't had a setup like that in about 3 years, so it may have changed. But exclusivity had no effect. I had Yamaha and Marantz receivers. 

[softworkz 5066]

16 minutes ago, generiq said:

I had several AV receivers. 7.1.2 setup. If Windows audio was configured to stereo, regardless of what channel config I set in mpv, it was always downmixed to stereo. I haven't had a setup like that in about 3 years, so it may have changed. But exclusivity had no effect. I had Yamaha and Marantz receivers. 

Connected via HDMI or via digital out?

For digital out it's not even possible to set a channel configuration in Win 11.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, softworkz said:

Connected via HDMI or via digital out?

For digital out it's not even possible to set a channel configuration in Win 11.

Always HDMI 

PC directly to receiver 

Edited December 8, 2024 by generiq

[softworkz 5066]

Then it has either changed in Win11 - or it's also possible that the driver can decide (for cases like I mentioned above).

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, softworkz said:

Then it has either changed in Win11 - or it's also possible that the driver can decide (for cases like I mentioned above).

I did specify that at the time I was using Win 10. Win 11 does appear to have different logic. A lot of these guys appear to be still using Win 10.

[softworkz 5066]

1 hour ago, generiq said:

A lot of these guys appear to be still using Win 10.

Not really, it's less than 10%

[Guest]

53 minutes ago, softworkz said:

Not really, it's less than 10%

I said a lot, not the majority. For me, 10% is a lot. Enough to not be ignored.

[softworkz 5066]

What's your point? It was about the information we're giving, and that should match what the majority is seeing rather than a constantly decreasing minority.
The side note that it might have been different on Win 10 or (also well possible) may be dependant on the driver has been made, so all is good IMO.   

[legierk 8]

I was watching the conversation with interest. I am indeed on HDMI and Windows 11. In fact, I am OCD about updates, equipment, etc. All certified HDMI cables, yada yada. I would "guess" that most ppl who are into this sort of thing are a "little" saavy about how stuff works, but that is just a guess. 

In any event, I don;t have Emby Beta, so I don't have the features that are shown in the photo by softworkz. I will await the next Windows Desktop release to see if those features have been added yet. I did learn about exclusive mode in Windows though which will be helpful. My AVRs are modern...a Denon 3800 and a Denon 4800. No modern reciever to my knowledge can do anything with AAC. Which is why the setting on the Roku App to just target AAC transcoding it to AC3 is such a stroke of brilliance.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, legierk said:

I was watching the conversation with interest. I am indeed on HDMI and Windows 11. In fact, I am OCD about updates, equipment, etc. All certified HDMI cables, yada yada. I would "guess" that most ppl who are into this sort of thing are a "little" saavy about how stuff works, but that is just a guess. 

In any event, I don;t have Emby Beta, so I don't have the features that are shown in the photo by softworkz. I will await the next Windows Desktop release to see if those features have been added yet. I did learn about exclusive mode in Windows though which will be helpful. My AVRs are modern...a Denon 3800 and a Denon 4800. No modern reciever to my knowledge can do anything with AAC. Which is why the setting on the Roku App to just target AAC transcoding it to AC3 is such a stroke of brilliance.

If all you want is to simply play AAC, then you don't have to do anything. mpv will decode it and send it as uncompressed (PCM) audio, as softworkz has shown.

Other apps will operate differently.

In my case, when I had home theater, I had multiple configs to alter the default. One example was for music. Stereo sucks and is very boring. So I would output as surround (not all channel surround, that sucks too). Either using the AC3 encoder or the surround filter. Such things will not be possible with the new app. So, boring stereo