FR: Option to sort music into groups (e.g. Albums, Live, Single, etc.)

[MindBullet 93]

Hey there guys,

I've proposed this in some thread already, but I think it would be very handy to sort media of artists into different groups, as musicbrainz does for example.

For instance, implement the option to enable sorting artist's music into, e.g., "Albums", "Singles", "Live albums", "Compilations", etc.

I have no idea if this is quickly done or rather takes a lot of work, but it would be very cool to have imho. Currently, media of bands like AC/DC or Michael Jackson, so artists making music since some decades, have 50+ albums/singles/etc. cluttering the artist view, making it very hard to find a specific item of that artist.

If we would have the option to have this sorted out into different groups, it'd make the artist view more cleaned up.

Cheers boys and girls! Have a great day (or night) ahead!

[ebr 16169]

Hi.  You could do this now with our "tags" right?  Its just that on the Artist screen we don't show them grouped this way?

[MindBullet 93]

Hey there ebr!

Thanks for chiming in. How could I achieve this with tags?

21 hours ago, ebr said:

Its just that on the Artist screen we don't show them grouped this way?

Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. To automatically have all media items sorted into their respective group on the artist screen (Album, Single, Live, Compilation, etc.)

As an example:

Edited September 23, 2023 by MindBullet

[ebr 16169]

51 minutes ago, MindBullet said:

How could I achieve this with tags?

You could achieve the basic organization by adding those tags to your albums and then you could view them that way via the "Tags" tab. However, you wouldn't see that on an artist page.

I'm just saying you can get the classifications you want - just not the display exactly like you want so that would have to be added.

[MindBullet 93]

Yeah, that might be a temporary solution, but I (will) have tenthousands of albums, so doing this manually doesn't quite work

[MindBullet 93]

Doing this for a few hundred items would be a pain already, but currently I have ~4k albums and will have a lot more. So manually tagging all albums 1 by 1 isn't very practicable

[ebr 16169]

23 hours ago, MindBullet said:

so doing this manually doesn't quite work

How else would these categorizations that you've come up with be done...?

[MindBullet 93]

1 hour ago, ebr said:

How else would these categorizations that you've come up with be done...?

Well, as an option on the Emby server side  Just like Plex other server infrastructure providers do.

I don't have the technical knowledge how exactly it's done, but as all of those items are categorized on musicbrainz already - and we/Emby use/s musicbrainz - it shouldn't be to hard to tell any artist: "This is an album, this is a single, this is a compilation", at least that's what I assume that it wouldn't be too hard, as they're already categorized on musicbrainz' end.

Edited September 24, 2023 by MindBullet

[MindBullet 93]

I think Emby or the musicbrainz plugin would just need the ability to catch musicbrainz' categories and reflect that in the artist view. That's what I think it needs, but again, I'm not tech-savvy enough to say how this would be achieved

Edited September 24, 2023 by MindBullet

[MindBullet 93]

It doesn't look like this exactly, but maybe you get an idea of what I mean (Not sure if you can open it without a linkedin account):

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/damienmustaphi_music-design-software-activity-7020862084003368960-lER7/?originalSubdomain=lt

[Vicpa 611]

Hi,

I can see value in knowing album vs single vs ep and studio vs live, Compilation (a guess they could be either).

 

@Luke, @ebr

I think you can get some of this from Picard's standard tag "RELEASETYPE:"

it seems to be a multi value  ie :    album;live

Below are a couple of ffprobe results examples,

ffprobe REALEASETYPE (album;live).txt

ffprobe REALEASETYPE (album).txt

 

Thanks,

-vicpa

[ebr 16169]

Yes, if there is a way to obtain from tags or external sources, that would be much better.

[user24 313]

On 9/22/2023 at 7:41 AM, MindBullet said:

I've proposed this in some thread already, but I think it would be very handy to sort media of artists into different groups, as musicbrainz does for example.

For instance, implement the option to enable sorting artist's music into, e.g., "Albums", "Singles", "Live albums", "Compilations", etc.

On 9/25/2023 at 7:14 AM, Vicpa said:

I can see value in knowing album vs single vs ep and studio vs live, Compilation (a guess they could be either).

This is an interesting idea that may have benefit to many users, me included (but possibly on a limited basis?). In my use case I have 1700+ Album Artists (so far) of which 70+ have between 20 and 110 albums.  The rest have less than 20 albums. So for 5% of my Album Artists the groupings would be very worthwhile, but for the rest it probably wouldn't matter greatly.

I like the categories that have been suggested, i.e.:

• Studio Albums
• Singles / EPs
• Live Albums
• Compilations

This seems to be very common amongst online music database sources.

Invariably there would always need to be an "Other" Category as a catch-all for everything that didn't fit well within the defined categories. Off-hand I can think of: Soundtracks, Music Videos, Bootlegs, Unreleased Albums, FM Broadcasts, Box Sets, Deluxe Editions, Remasters. The list goes on...!

Using a user-defined Emby "Release Type" tag does have some merit, I think. Then every user can determine what release types best suit their own music collection. It could be as simple or complex, as required. And, it would only need to be used by those who wanted to.

Emby could allow Albums to be sorted/filtered by Release Type and/or have the option of showing the Release Type underneath the Album Cover picture.

E.g. ... / Settings / Show Fields / Release Type / Live

On 9/23/2023 at 9:37 PM, ebr said:

You could achieve the basic organization by adding those tags to your albums and then you could view them that way via the "Tags" tab. However, you wouldn't see that on an artist page.

I'm just saying you can get the classifications you want - just not the display exactly like you want so that would have to be added.

At the moment if Albums are Emby tagged (e.g) as "Live" it is also possible to view all the Albums on an Album Artist page and then filter by the "Live" tag without going to the Tags tab. That way you can see all the "Live" Albums of the Artist at 1 level down on the Artist page. I know that is not what @MindBulletis suggesting. I was just interested in trying to find another possible (easy!) workaround to get a viable option. 

Anyway, it's a good suggestion and has got me thinking about new and better ways to organise my music!

[Tremas 197]

On 9/24/2023 at 5:44 PM, Vicpa said:

Hi,

I can see value in knowing album vs single vs ep and studio vs live, Compilation (a guess they could be either).

 

@Luke, @ebr

I think you can get some of this from Picard's standard tag "RELEASETYPE:"

it seems to be a multi value  ie :    album;live

Below are a couple of ffprobe results examples,

ffprobe REALEASETYPE (album;live).txt 12.68 kB · 2 downloads

ffprobe REALEASETYPE (album).txt 8.38 kB · 0 downloads

 

Thanks,

-vicpa

Fully supporting Release Group / Type from MusicBrainz would be super helpful in improving life for those who use Audio Books (and Audio Drama). MusicBrainz recognizes primary Release Types (album, single, EP, etc.) as well as secondary Types (Soundtrack, Live, Audiobook, Demo, etc.). See here:  https://musicbrainz.org/doc/Release_Group/Type

For those who have been trying to get a polished presentation/navigation experience with Audio Books this would be huge. Many books have excellent metadata on MusicBrainz and it would be huge if Emby could finally support the data for narrator, author, series (book number in series), etc.

[ginjaninja 605]

related to this? this thread outlines what the album type schema is (or at least was) from MBZ

 

[user24 313]

On 12/16/2023 at 7:57 AM, ginjaninja said:

related to this? this thread outlines what the album type schema is (or at least was) from MBZ

@ginjaninjaThanks for providing the detailed and well thought through info - good to know. I hadn't seen this older thread.

Another possibly could be to designate the Release Type  as an icon image overlay using the Iconic Image Enhancer plugin when (if?) it is updated to work with music files.

This way it would be possible to see all albums together, but easily make the distinction as to which were studio, live. compilation, soundtrack, etc.

If worthwhile, it would be great if the Emby music gurus could champion this on the relevant plugin thread

[user24 313]

Hi all, hmmm, I’m not sure why I didn’t think of this much earlier than now...

The newish Group by function for Collections would potentially be a great way to give the option of implementing a Release Type ordering for various Album pages/views. I would definitely use this for the Album views ‘below’ the detailed Album Artist/Artist/Composer pages, but it could also be useful for other Album pages as well.

Having a default of “None” would mean no change to current Album pages unless it was specifically implemented:

Group by

• None                     ✓
• Release Type

If would be perfect if this could be applied on a specific Albums page basis, rather than an overall setting being applied to all Album pages, if that was technical possible?

The Group By button could (e.g.) be nicely placed between the Sort By and Filter By functions, to be reasonably consistent with the Collections implementation, though could easily fit anywhere in the menu bar without overcrowding (before and after shown example below):

Implementing Album Release Type in this way would not impact negatively on anyone who didn’t want to use it and would also give Emby better usefulness for music enthusiasts.

Thanks for considering!

[Luke 42077]

On 10/21/2024 at 6:03 PM, user24 said:

Hi all, hmmm, I’m not sure why I didn’t think of this much earlier than now...

The newish Group by function for Collections would potentially be a great way to give the option of implementing a Release Type ordering for various Album pages/views. I would definitely use this for the Album views ‘below’ the detailed Album Artist/Artist/Composer pages, but it could also be useful for other Album pages as well.

Having a default of “None” would mean no change to current Album pages unless it was specifically implemented:

Group by

• None                     ✓
• Release Type

If would be perfect if this could be applied on a specific Albums page basis, rather than an overall setting being applied to all Album pages, if that was technical possible?

The Group By button could (e.g.) be nicely placed between the Sort By and Filter By functions, to be reasonably consistent with the Collections implementation, though could easily fit anywhere in the menu bar without overcrowding (before and after shown example below):

Implementing Album Release Type in this way would not impact negatively on anyone who didn’t want to use it and would also give Emby better usefulness for music enthusiasts.

Thanks for considering!

What are the possible values for album release type? 

[user24 313]

9 hours ago, Luke said:

What are the possible values for album release type? 

From a bit of online research across: music documentation websites (e.g Wikipedia, MusicBrainz), media server websites (e.g. Plex, Roon), music streaming websites (e.g. Apple Music, Tidal)... and more... these 6 (+1) Release Type categories tend to be very widely used:

• Studio Album
• Live Album
• Single
• EP
• Compilation
• Soundtrack
• Other

This is also very similar to what has mostly been suggested in this thread and other threads already. Therefore these would be useful fixed Album Release Type values for Emby to incorporate. (Note: whatever categories are potentially chosen, there would always need to be an “Other” category at the end, as a ‘catch-all’ for everything not covered in the main categories.)

Anything much greater than the 7 categories mentioned above (irrespective of the actual categories chosen) could potentially be ‘overkill’ for the vast majority.

From my perspective (having circa 10k contemporary, non-classical, albums) even a minimal approach of just 4 categories would be extremely useful:

• Studio Album
• Live Album
• Single/EP
• Other

Anything less than these 4 would likely not give enough benefit to myself (and anyone else?) wanting to Group By Release Type.

Another very important consideration is being able to import the RELEASETYPE tag from embedded metadata. As mentioned previously by @Vicpa Picard have RELEASETYPE as a standard tag. I expect it could also be added into Mp3tag quite easily? I don’t think I would want to carefully put all the effort into adding Release Type to all my albums just in Emby only, but I would happily do this in Mp3tag and import into Emby (even if still somewhat time consuming).

Previously @ginjaninja @Tremas have provided some links to the relevant MusicBrainz Release Group/Type categories. This is also good info. However, even if it is technically possible for Emby to automatically fetch the MusicBrainz two-tier release types (or possibly even allow for custom release types?) this could start to quickly move away from the ‘sweet-spot’ of 4-7 common music Release Type categories, towards ‘overkill’ (for my music library anyway).

Emby defined category Release Type values (e.g. Studio Album) could be imported from embedded metadata into the relevant category.

Unrecognised and blank Release Types could be imported into the “Other” category. (E.g. my "FM Broadcast" albums would appear under "Other" - but this isn't a common category that everyone would have - and I could easily accept this grouping.)

Anyone with all (or most) of their music undefined in “Other” would likely use “Group by None” and may not use/need Release Type grouping?

Anyone using “Group by Release Type” with too much blank/unrecognised music in “Other” would quickly organise it!

I think Group by  Release Type would be a great addition for many, once they find out about it. 

As Luke has asked the question, anyone else who is (still) interested should also comment with their answer... Let's do it!

[Tremas 197]

For me, the main reason to support release type is to support Release Groups and other audio types outside of music which would primarily be audiobooks. Release groups in MusicBrainz are ways to enable series and series ordering for things like audiobooks (multiple books in a series), radio shows, audio dramas, podcasts, etc. These would not be used in a Music Library, but an Audiobook library.

Specifically for MusicBrainz, Types Broadcast and Other along with Secondary types audiobook, audio drama.

From the audiobook perspective, there is a tremendous amount of metadata that can be added via MusicBrainz that would improve the audiobook experience by including formal support for narrator, writer, and most importantly series/series order. Unless I am mistaken, Release Groups what is represented in the "Part of" sections in the example below. Being able to formally support audiobook series order would resolve a lot of long standing requests.

For example:
https://musicbrainz.org/release/e2310769-2e68-462f-b54f-25ac8e3f1a21

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Audio Drama goes even further. I would love to be able to get full cast and credits for, not to mention series order into emby through MusicBrainz (Picard) rather than having to enter it manually every time. Just look at how much cast and credit data is just there for the taking, but we can't get it out and into emby:

https://musicbrainz.org/release/9dd53391-7d7d-4528-b9ea-4793b10ed1d3

 

Full cast. Full Crew. Series. Series order. Multiple Series. If only...

There is a long discussion of these concepts here:

 

[user24 313]

I just now happened to be looking at the Bruce Springsteen official website.... https://brucespringsteen.net/

Interestingly and coincidently, this also uses very similar (and practical) Album Release Types to those previously mentioned:

Additionally, this also highlights that Group By Decade would also be a very nice addition for Albums within Emby!!!

[MistD 32]

I second this. 

Nowadays, artists release mostly Singles that are not part of any Album (thx to streaming services). There is a need to differentiate between an "Album" and a "Single" (track released as "single" and not being part of any album) in artist profile at least.

So, here comes the "RELEASETYPE" tag.
Supporting the "RELEASETYPE" tag and splitting Albums from other releases (EX: Singles) in the Artist profile page will be awesome. This way we can properly organize things.
Currently I have all the "Singles" tagged under a regular album named "Singles" ... but this is rather messy and just a workaround: the new releases remain "burried" in the fake "singles" albums, the album date is fixed (even when new singles are added), the cover art is mostly random (picked from one of the songs) ... and so on.

Supporting the "RELEASETYPE" and splitting things up by this tag will be great ! 
 

[Brendon 119]

Raising this from the dead to add another yes please vote.

[MindBullet 93]

Good idea! Giving my +1 too (again, hehe)

[Luke 42077]

This sounds like a Collection, no? Or a Tag? Those are two grouping functions that allow you to make any kind of grouping that you want.