Playlist Sorting - Does it remember original sort order?

[MBSki 1114]

I like the option to sort music playlists, but I'm a little concerned with a user accidentally sorting my meticulously choronoligically sorted Marvel, Star Wars, and Star Trek playlists that each have more than 500 items. Is the original sort order stored somewhere so we can always get back to it? And what happens if we change the sort order directly in the xml file? Is the original sort order updated? 

[Luke 42080]

Each user can order the playlist how they wish, and yes, the original order is remembered.

[MBSki 1114]

2 minutes ago, Luke said:

Each user can order the playlist how they wish, and yes, the original order is remembered.

Ok, good, thank you. So when you use the sort, it doesn't save anything back to the xml (soon to be m3u) file correct? 

[ebr 16185]

What is the definition of "original sort order" given one can manually re-order items?

So, for instance, if one sorted by album and then manually dragged one item to a new location, is that sort now the "original" one?

[MBSki 1114]

4 minutes ago, ebr said:

What is the definition of "original sort order" given one can manually re-order items?

So, for instance, if one sorted by album and then manually dragged one item to a new location, is that sort now the "original" one?

Yes, I couldn't think of another term to use. But yes, right now the playlist can be adjusted and once it's adjusted it saves in that new order. But that's hopefully different than sorting. I think Luke is saying that sorting does NOT change the order in the underlying xml file at all, unlike what happens when an item is manually dragged to a different location in the playlist. Am I understanding that correctly?

[Luke 42080]

Correct it doesn't. That's why you've got the sort option to set it back to Playlist Order.

[MBSki 1114]

6 minutes ago, Luke said:

Correct it doesn't. That's why you've got the sort option to set it back to Playlist Order.

Awesome! That's what I thought, but since I can't see the code behind "playlist order" I have no idea what's actually going on. I think I can rest easy now knowing my 3 massive playlists will remain untouched.

 

[ebr 16185]

3 hours ago, MBSki said:

Yes, I couldn't think of another term to use. But yes, right now the playlist can be adjusted and once it's adjusted it saves in that new order. But that's hopefully different than sorting. I think Luke is saying that sorting does NOT change the order in the underlying xml file at all, unlike what happens when an item is manually dragged to a different location in the playlist. Am I understanding that correctly?

Right, but look at the exact steps that I laid out.  I think in that case, the "original order" is going to get changed to sorted by album (except for one item moved). 

3 hours ago, ebr said:

So, for instance, if one sorted by album and then manually dragged one item to a new location

That may not be what the user is expecting but I'm not sure what else we can do about it - given you can manually re-order them.  Then, how about another example:

Add an item to an existing playlist that was just sorted by something other than "original" - is that also going to alter the "original" order?

[MBSki 1114]

2 hours ago, ebr said:

Right, but look at the exact steps that I laid out.  I think in that case, the "original order" is going to get changed to sorted by album (except for one item moved). 

I just tested and the only change that is saved is the manual move. Here are the steps I took to test it out:

1. I moved an item manually to the top of my playlist.
2. I clicked the Album sort.
3. I changed the sort back to Playlist Order and the manual move was saved and all the other items where sorted the same as before the manual move.

So, the Album sort had no effect on the "original" or saved sort order. That's how I hoped it would work and I'm really glad it does.   

[ebr 16185]

On 11/9/2022 at 7:32 PM, MBSki said:

I just tested and the only change that is saved is the manual move. Here are the steps I took to test it out:

1. I moved an item manually to the top of my playlist.
2. I clicked the Album sort.
3. I changed the sort back to Playlist Order and the manual move was saved and all the other items where sorted the same as before the manual move.

So, the Album sort had no effect on the "original" or saved sort order. That's how I hoped it would work and I'm really glad it does.   

Your first two steps are out of order.

On 11/9/2022 at 1:45 PM, ebr said:

if one sorted by album and then manually dragged one item to a new location

 

[MBSki 1114]

5 minutes ago, ebr said:

Your first two steps are out of order.

 

What are you trying to prove?

[ebr 16185]

1 minute ago, MBSki said:

What are you trying to prove?

I'm not trying to prove anything.  I'm pointing out that there may be some behavior here that may be unexpected and undesired...

[roaku 842]

6 minutes ago, MBSki said:

What are you trying to prove?

He's trying to help you avoid the situation you said you were concerned about.

[MBSki 1114]

5 minutes ago, ebr said:

I'm not trying to prove anything.  I'm pointing out that there may be some behavior here that may be unexpected and undesired...

Ok, so is there something not working as you would expect it to? If the xml file is getting saved when it shouldn't them I would be concerned about that, but I'm not seeing that behavior. Have you seen it?

Just now, roaku said:

He's trying to help you avoid the situation you said you were concerned about.

No, I already proved that what I was concerned about is not an issue. He's on to a slightly different topic. That's ok, I was just trying to figure out what he was on to.

[ebr 16185]

If you do exactly what I suggested, it changes your "original" order, correct?  I'm just pointing out that that may not be what people are expecting in that situation.  And the other situation was, sort by something other than original and then add another item to the list - I haven't tested it but I think that is also going to change your original order - again maybe not what you would expect or want.

The only thing we could do about it though is to put a manual save button on the screen and/or a warning/confirmation that the "orginal" order is about to be changed.

[MBSki 1114]

5 minutes ago, ebr said:

If you do exactly what I suggested, it changes your "original" order, correct?  I'm just pointing out that that may not be what people are expecting in that situation.  And the other situation was, sort by something other than original and then add another item to the list - I haven't tested it but I think that is also going to change your original order - again maybe not what you would expect or want.

The only thing we could do about it though is to put a manual save button on the screen and/or a warning/confirmation that the "orginal" order is about to be changed.

So are you seeing the xml file get updated in the situations you've described? I haven't yet, but I'll try it again. That would definitely be a concern if it is.

[ebr 16185]

Just now, MBSki said:

So are you seeing the xml file get updated in the situations you've described?

I have not tested it.  If you test it and it doesn't happen as I describe, that's great.  Perhaps it only saves if you are sorted by "original".  That would be another solution I hadn't thought of and maybe Luke did.

[MBSki 1114]

52 minutes ago, ebr said:

I have not tested it.  If you test it and it doesn't happen as I describe, that's great.  Perhaps it only saves if you are sorted by "original".  That would be another solution I hadn't thought of and maybe Luke did.

Yea, agreed. That's what I was thinking too. 

[MBSki 1114]

@ebr I just tested this and the manual drag and re-order is actually disabled on any sort other than Playlist Order. That's a good idea IMO. Luke did a good job designing this feature.