My ears (and brain) are being tricked and I just want to know how.

[roaku 795]

If it's someone's dream to get a Doppler effect going between their ears and their speakers, they could always pick up a Leslie, but I don't think it'll make their TV shows sound better.

https://ask.audio/articles/understanding-the-leslie-effect

Edited March 14, 2021 by roaku

[Gilgamesh_48 943]

Thanks everyone for the explanations. They mostly make good sense.

Remember that this is about a science fiction show and, mostly, those kind of shows get the science wrong. Like having sound in space or craft "banking" in space or running out of fuel and coming to a stop. In fiction the science does not have to make sense and the viewer/reader needs to suspend their disbelief for a time to enjoy the story.

I was  just asking about the audio effect that make front to back or back to front movement seem to be happening in the sound from just stereo speakers.

I can say the effect seems quite real while I know that it is just fooling my brain I find that some sounds on some TV shows/movies are very good at that fooling. Maybe my brain is simply quite gullible.

Thanks for all the insights, I never expected so many answers.

[mrfragger 39]

This brain talk with sound reminded me of echo free chambers. Most people can’t last more than 45 minutes isolated in an anechoic chamber without losing their mind. 
 

When it’s quiet, Your ears start adapting. With no sound coming from your surroundings, your whole focus turns to your own body. The effect of this is that you start hearing the sounds that you are making yourself. So you start hearing your heartbeat, blood pumping through your head, noises made by your digestive system and the creaking of joints. 

Link to article 

[CharleyVarrick 277]

On 3/14/2021 at 2:22 PM, Gilgamesh_48 said:

Thanks everyone for the explanations. They mostly make good sense.

Remember that this is about a science fiction show and, mostly, those kind of shows get the science wrong. Like having sound in space or craft "banking" in space or running out of fuel and coming to a stop. In fiction the science does not have to make sense and the viewer/reader needs to suspend their disbelief for a time to enjoy the story.

I was  just asking about the audio effect that make front to back or back to front movement seem to be happening in the sound from just stereo speakers.

I can say the effect seems quite real while I know that it is just fooling my brain I find that some sounds on some TV shows/movies are very good at that fooling. Maybe my brain is simply quite gullible.

Thanks for all the insights, I never expected so many answers.

It was a great question, so you got some great answers, and a bit of friendly phaser fire on the side, but only set to stun.

My mea culpa is I could have been more precise with my Doppler theory.

Even rudimentary tech can reproduce it rather well, as it is mostly varying pitch and intensity that sends the incoming/receding info to your ears and that gullible thing between them.And yes, creating a similar effect from basic sound mixing is possible and more practical now than in the old days.

 

Basic 1 axis sense of direction requires more stuff, and then full 3D sense of direction, while observed everywhere around us in the real world, is a technical wonder to reproduce, let alone create from scratch..

Having said that, I think I'll go watch and listen to Voyager opening*. 

1 to beam out

* Is this the scene you were referring to?

Edited March 15, 2021 by CharleyVarrick

[Gilgamesh_48 943]

2 hours ago, CharleyVarrick said:

It was a great question, so you got some great answers, and a bit of friendly phaser fire on the side, but only set to stun.

My mea culpa is I could have been more precise with my Doppler theory.

Even rudimentary tech can reproduce it rather well, as it is mostly varying pitch and intensity that sends the incoming/receding info to your ears and that gullible thing between them.And yes, creating a similar effect from basic sound mixing is possible and more practical now than in the old days.

 

Basic 1 axis sense of direction requires more stuff, and then full 3D sense of direction, while observed everywhere around us in the real world, is a technical wonder to reproduce, let alone create from scratch..

Having said that, I think I'll go watch and listen to Voyager opening*. 

1 to beam out

* Is this the scene you were referring to?

Yes, that is the scene.

[CharleyVarrick 277]

1 minute ago, Gilgamesh_48 said:

Yes, that is the scene.

I wasnt sure as it barely last 2 seconds (those damn spaceship moves so fast)

I did not experience any back to front effect on my pc so either I have crap hw or you have a bit of imagination.

Tend to favor the later, knowing how much this thing cost me.

Nothing wrong with imagination btw

[Gilgamesh_48 943]

Just now, CharleyVarrick said:

I wasnt sure as it barely last 2 seconds (those damn spaceship moves so fast)

I did not experience any back to front effect on my pc so either I have crap hw or you have a bit of imagination.

Tend to favor the later, knowing how much this thing cost me.

Nothing wrong with imagination btw

In my original post I mentioned my speaker placement and that may be part of the issue. In my TV watching setup the speakers are directly to my left and right only about a foot and a half from my ears. Someone earlier mentioned the speakers and my head forming an equilateral triangle; well, in my case it is a straight line from speaker "A" to my head to speaker "B." I guess, technically, that is an "equilateral triangle" with a height of zero. That could be part of what I perceive.

BTW: I do not hear the same effect when I play the clip on my computer. However my computer's speakers are more traditionally placed to the front and left and right. I do not know if it is speaker placement, the computer's audio processor or something missing in the clip. I may place that clip in a video library and test it through Emby.  But it seems to not really have the urgency of some other projects that need to get done.

[CharleyVarrick 277]

1 minute ago, Gilgamesh_48 said:

But it seems to not really have the urgency of some other projects that need to get done.

Probably not, but its fun

I'll give it a shot (if and when) wife can let go the living room setup with all the tech goodies

 

I just realized my Star Trek Voyager collection is all dvdrip SD avi, yours?

[Guest]

Now I feel left out.. looking for this on Youtube..

Funny thing is I have experienced this before. With more than one thing. and the Voyager but back in the day when it was on TV..

Edited March 15, 2021 by Guest

[CharleyVarrick 277]

Youtube does offer supposedly 4k but I suspect flaky upconvert

kinda taking your driver license pic and blowing it up 8 feet high

https://treknews.net/2017/02/02/why-ds9-voyager-not-on-blu-ray-hd/

 

Edited March 15, 2021 by CharleyVarrick

[Guest]

That was a good quality...

Mine goes left to right with low frequency sound the mid hi's to hi's are actually right to center in low quality.. 

The one above....

Two sounds.. the movement of the ship through the vacuum of space ( like wind ), and what would be engine noise which fades..still leaving the wind effect.. while your eyes register the engine noise drifting off with the ship.. Mind attaches sound to the object in question...

The sound still starts in left.. with frequency change as it is approaching the edge of your screen before it shows up with the change of the sound and fading going past.. and slight noise does rise in the right... with the wind simulation taking place.. panning and volume or gain..

[CharleyVarrick 277]

31 minutes ago, Gilgamesh_48 said:

 In my TV watching setup the speakers are directly to my left and right only about a foot and a half from my ears.

 

Trying hard to picture someone watching tv with speakers only 18" from ears.

I use to do this as a kid (tv were much smaller back then)

[Guest]

OMG.... CRT TV and monitors to burn out your retinas.. lol I have two Sony cs - ss3 i think is the model.. a 50"..  the speakers are currently on either side of the screen... I should move them.. Before someone blew out my old ones.. they were also small sony bookshelf speakers that came with a micro system.. I had them in the floor tilted back and at an angle.. Those little speakers used to give me all kind of weird effects which were cool because the sound wasn't traveling directly to my ears..

[CharleyVarrick 277]

On 3/14/2021 at 2:22 PM, Gilgamesh_48 said:

Remember that this is about a science fiction show and, mostly, those kind of shows get the science wrong. Like having sound in space or craft "banking" in space or running out of fuel and coming to a stop. In fiction the science does not have to make sense and the viewer/reader needs to suspend their disbelief for a time to enjoy the story.

 

Imagine how it would feel for human body to go from stand still to Warp. A Saturn rocket or space shuttle is 3G: Say you weigh 200 lbs, during takeoff you feel 600 lbs; 99.9% of us would black out.

Always ask sales mgr for inertial damper option along with lifetime rust proofing.

But SF is meant to be a break from reality isnt it.

I'd sure could use a few photon torpedoes when driving around.

[Guest]

Yeah.. or the Implosion devices with no evidence... ( Look MA.. no bleach! ) ...and portable transporter for those things just out of reach financially....

Edited March 15, 2021 by Guest

[Gilgamesh_48 943]

54 minutes ago, CharleyVarrick said:

Probably not, but its fun

I'll give it a shot (if and when) wife can let go the living room setup with all the tech goodies

 

I just realized my Star Trek Voyager collection is all dvdrip SD avi, yours?

My collection was purchased some time ago and I ripped it to first mp4 and then later, as the software improved, I ripped it again into an mkv container and that is where it stands now. Even way back when Voyager was just coming out I avoided avi almost completely. It was an outdated format back then and now it is so old it stinkuth.

[Guest]

AVI was good for compression and quality if done right, BUT it has no form of retaining or having any metadata whatsoever.. I prefer MKV myself.. mp4 can work and be high quality.. but has different tags available.. 

I tend to get better quality and options with MKV containers.. definitely better for curation.

[CharleyVarrick 277]

Youtube offers a ton of relative size comparison of planets and stars, I like this one.

Something to think about when you hear some one complain 'why did (insert name) moved so far away; it'll takes us forever to drive over there"

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 15, 2021 by CharleyVarrick

[Guest]

Information and data are processed in the brain with proof.. so acceptance of that information is subjective until it proves itself.. to the individual... Even if you setup in this guys house and studied the sound with highly specialized equipment.. the explanation each of us have are theoretical and each instance could be said to be true through perception.. from any group of people. Even when to people are essentially saying the same thing. Being less of a debatable thing... Each person in a lab study given the same information may understand it differently given their personal psychological connection to said information and is a side effect of how we learn touch feel and understand our outside world... Until we observe, take in data, process it with our method of approach.. and data we are given along with those associations.. and detail we eventually come along to the next level..

Common...human behavior.. we teach and then we allow individuals to come along at their own pace. What they do with information and how they associate it is not necessarily our responsibility, we can answer questions and fill in blanks where it is questioned. Some things do come later, reinforce with their own accrued personal experiences.. even trial and error in progression along the timeline..

We don't all do it the same way.. and the areas in which some of these areas are compartmentalized differently from person to person.. therefore resistance to new information or data as stated by another person ( which we know inside, unspoken ) even trust in realities as observed or stated. Have to be proven the same as the truth we associate within our own brains. So much is wrong to how we understand it n our brains versus the place others are in their 'journey' to truth.

FACT should not be, but is a subjective word to the person stating it.

Edited March 15, 2021 by Guest