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PBS Episode Numbering


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Episode numbering of shows on PBS seems to be the bane of all EPGs -- probably because they frequently air two 15 minute episodes back to back.

My latest example (and the first on Emby) is Daniel Tiger.

Here is what is queued to record:

image.png.6cfc32f23054e8421909257937b30b6b.png

That airing is actually two episodes ("Calm at the Restaurant" and "Calm in Class").

TheTVDB, on the other hand, lists each of those two as separate episodes (along with all the other ones in that season), so the episode numbering is off.  (This turns out to be convenient because occasionally I get single 15 minute episodes, like from a DVD).

image.png.1ef9488a7b2052821e42692747c2612d.png

I do have to give a special shout-out to Emby for actually dealing with dual episode files!! This is awesome.  I just rename the file to have both (S04E32E33) and it shows up perfectly.  Here is an example already in my library:

image.png.e270aa2c1d450fb8ffd9a8a09ea2d9b7.png

Dealing with the multiple episode file and downloading the descriptions for both is super-duper helpful when I need to find a specific episode for my kids ("you know! the one where they play at the park!")

Mostly, this is a problem because the "is this episode already recorded" detector doesn't work since the episode numbering doesn't match (however, Emby gets big props for the "Do not record" button on the episode schedule!!)

A further inconvenience is that I have to go in and rename the file in order for it show up correctly in the library.

I'm sure an argument could be made that the EPG's episode numbering is "better" in some ways (though I disagree) -- the bigger problem is that it doesn't match what is being used in the library (TheTVDB).

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Luke

@cayars can report this to our guide data provider, but they may very well come back and say tvdb is wrong.

It may just be that you'll have to disable internet metadata on the recordings library to prevent tvdb data from getting filled in, or lock the metadata of the tv series. 

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cayars

This isn't really anything to do with the meta-data providers.  It's the way the network broadcasts these.  Looking at the above pic you'll see it broadcast two episodes in the same time slot and they were: "Calm at the Restaurant" and "Calm in Class".

They don't need to follow each other and could be random episodes which you'll see for repeats.

The problem is Emby doesn't know how to name these correct and of course records 2 episodes as one file.

There really isn't anything our guide data provider can do as their data is correct.

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Happy2Play
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cayars

@SHyde Can you show us the exact file name Emby uses to record an set of these episodes?
If you have a couple of files to show us, even better.

@Happy2Play No clue where it's coming from but maybe the file names Emby DVR uses plays into this.
If just set this series up to record so after a few days I'll have something to work off of as well.

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SHSPVR
17 hours ago, Happy2Play said:

My guest is the dim wit that did the guide scheduling

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11 hours ago, cayars said:

@SHyde Can you show us the exact file name Emby uses to record an set of these episodes?
If you have a couple of files to show us, even better.

I've only had one record so far:

Daniel Tiger's Neighborhood S04E15 Mad at the Crayon Factory; Mad at School.nfo

That got saved as

Daniel Tiger's Neighborhood S04E15 Mad at the Crayon Factory; Mad at School.ts

in the

Season 4

folder

(As an aside, I should probably put a feature request in for seasons to be zero-padded -- eg: Season 04)

 

Clearly, there are discrepancies about how these shows get numbered.  As I said, this has been a problem in the past with other systems and other EPGs.  I'm not sure whether there is any recourse with the EPG provider, since they will probably just point the finger at what they are getting from the channel.

I'm also not sure if there is an easy solution to the detection of the recording already being in the library, other than adopting the EPG's numbering scheme.  Though, if I do that, I'm not sure where the metadata would come from for the library.  (Also, it isn't clear how I would number the individual 15 min episodes I have).

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cayars

I've only record one episode as well and it's named on disc as:
Daniel Tiger's Neighborhood S01E17 Good Morning Daniel; Goodnight Daniel.ts

It shows in Emby in the Recorded folder like this:

image.thumb.png.42309e8f94c6ea26ddea55946d037159.png

So if left to use Emby's Guide data (NFO file info) it should retain the numbering used in the Guide Data itself and you would be best not allowing it to use 3rd party meta-data providers.

Do this should make everything function pretty well with Emby's DVR as well as it would be able to tell if something is recorded or not.

I've got another episode that will record today.  After this I'll copy these files over to my test setup and see how bad things get when added to a normal TV library.

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2 hours ago, cayars said:

I've only record one episode as well and it's named on disc as:
Daniel Tiger's Neighborhood S01E17 Good Morning Daniel; Goodnight Daniel.ts

It shows in Emby in the Recorded folder like this:

image.thumb.png.42309e8f94c6ea26ddea55946d037159.png

So if left to use Emby's Guide data (NFO file info) it should retain the numbering used in the Guide Data itself and you would be best not allowing it to use 3rd party meta-data providers.

Do this should make everything function pretty well with Emby's DVR as well as it would be able to tell if something is recorded or not.

I've got another episode that will record today.  After this I'll copy these files over to my test setup and see how bad things get when added to a normal TV library.

So that episode description comes from the .nfo file?  Note that in my example above, it only contains the description for the first of the two mini-episodes in the file.

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cayars
9 minutes ago, SHyde said:

So that episode description comes from the .nfo file?  Note that in my example above, it only contains the description for the first of the two mini-episodes in the file.

If I understand what you're asking, Emby pulls the info about the recording from the GUIDE data itself and uses this for the the RECORDING LIBRARY info and writes that info to the NFO file.

So what I'm going to try later today after I get the 2nd recording is move the TS file and the NFO file in tandem to my TV Library.  My hunch is if all episodes are recorded and moved this way you'll have valid meta-data and this will work well with Emby DVR to find and record missing episodes.

I'll update the thread later after doing this.

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Just now, cayars said:

If I understand what you're asking, Emby pulls the info about the recording from the GUIDE data itself and uses this for the the RECORDING LIBRARY info and writes that info to the NFO file.

So what I'm going to try later today after I get the 2nd recording is move the TS file and the NFO file in tandem to my TV Library.  My hunch is if all episodes are recorded and moved this way you'll have valid meta-data and this will work well with Emby DVR to find and record missing episodes.

I'll update the thread later after doing this.

Thanks for all your help with this.

My concern is that, based on that .nfo file I posted above, somehow the description of the second episode didn't get included.  I've paged through the guide and it looks like both descriptions are included, so maybe this was just a fluke.

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cayars

Good point.  I didn't look at what was in the guide data before it recorded.  So I'll do that now here so we can see before and after on my recording in a couple of hours.

This is what is going to record for me later today (what guide currently shows)

image.thumb.png.e781b09a347efbd00cf095ed303844c0.png

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cayars

Here is what it shows after recording.  Same as the guide data.

image.thumb.png.93d409eddb6a7ecb3bc00b11be29b14e.png

Contents of the NFO file

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" standalone="yes"?>
<episodedetails>
  <title>It's Love Day!; Daniel's Love Day Surprise</title>
  <aired>2015-02-09</aired>
  <episode>8</episode>
  <season>2</season>
  <dateadded>2021-02-09 16:27:00</dateadded>
  <year>2015</year>
  <mpaa>TV-Y</mpaa>
  <plot>Daniel and his friends dance, sing and tell jokes that show their love and care for each other; Daniel hides hearts around the house to show his love for Grandpere.</plot>
  <genre>Educational</genre>
  <genre>Entertainment</genre>
  <genre>Animated</genre>
  <genre>Children</genre>
  <genre>Kids</genre>
</episodedetails>

 

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Ok, so my example was hopefully just a fluke.

Now my main issue is that I have over a hundred episodes following the TVDB episode numbering 😜

I'm not quite sure how to get these to live happily with the ones being recorded.  I could convert them all to the OTA episode numbering scheme... except that I don't know what it is because it isn't listed anywhere.

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