Emby now closed-source..?

[chowbok 77]

In a comment to a (now closed) bug report, Luke offhandedly mentioned that Emby is no longer open-source. This, understandably, upset a lot of people. For my part, I'm less bothered by the change in license as the rather sneaky way it was announced. I think the users at least deserve a proper announcement, instead of attempting to bury it in an obscure location. It does not inspire confidence in Luke or the other developers.

 

Any thoughts?

[chowbok 77]

(By the way, the Github page still lists the Emby project as GPL 2.0. As does Emby's own "license" page.)

Edited December 9, 2018 by chowbok

[maegibbons 1267]

I think you are trying to.stir up trouble.

 

Just leave it.

 

Let the devs just develop.

 

You have already said that you are not to bothered by it.

 

Krs

 

Mark

 

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

[denz 426]

I dont care if it is open source or closed as long as they keep improving it so it is better for everyone that is the most important.

[chowbok 77]

I think you are trying to.stir up trouble.

 

Just leave it.

 

Let the devs just develop.

 

You have already said that you are not to bothered by it.

 

Krs

 

Mark

 

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

How does just mentioning it interfere with development? Is even the mildest criticism of the staff considered the act of a troublemaker? Geez, I hope the devs have a less dictatorial mindset than you do.

[Happy2Play 8377]

(By the way, the Github page still lists the Emby project as GPL 2.0. As does Emby's own "license" page.)

 

Well technically nothing changes until the next release.

[maegibbons 1267]

How does just mentioning it interfere with development? Is even the mildest criticism of the staff considered the act of a troublemaker? Geez, I hope the devs have a less dictatorial mindset than you do.

Because the devs then have to start concentrating on defending their decisions and position rather than getting on with coding!!

 

No dictatorial mindset - I just want emby to improve quickly without unnecessary distraction for the developers.

 

Krs

 

Matk

 

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

[timeslip1974 14]

the same query has had a lot of traction on Reddit...

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/emby/comments/a3r3zi/emby_server_is_now_proprietary_only_select/

 

for the record my response was > 

Big deal so certain modules arnt going to be open source. 99% of people who use the software wont ever contribute to it anyways. What 99% of people equate to open-source is free. If the developers are having to pay gracenote to bring their service upto par with Plex`s DVR providers I`ve no problem with the part of the software being for their eyes only. Reason I left Plex for Emby was the complete lack of focus from Plex for what I actually use the software and the refusal from the developers to communicate on their forums. Both of which Emby does in spades. I for one cant wait for the new updates

[chef 3751]

There is still a great API you can build plugins for your in emby server. So you might not be able to make pull requests for the core, but when was the last time anyone other the the lead developers changed the core?

 

If you want to add new options to your server, build a plug-in.

 

Closed or open source doesn't matter.

 

If you want to know how emby works, read articles on ffmpeg, and learn c# using .net core. Learn the standard web languages and that is all there is to it. It's just been put together in a very elegant way.

 

Hope that helps.

Edited December 9, 2018 by chef

[ebr 14966]

(By the way, the Github page still lists the Emby project as GPL 2.0. As does Emby's own "license" page.)

 

That repo that you are looking at is still GPL.

[Luke 37295]

We have 75 GitHub repositories and that number will keep growing. To say that we are closed source is not telling the whole story. We are committed to open sourcing as much as we can, to the extent that it does not threaten our ability to survive as a business.

[R2Rn 4]

Hello.... I'm new here, so I'm gonna armor-up before posting this, but here-goes.

 

Mark seems a bit hostile, perhaps I've missed some history... idunno. "Just leave it..."? And Chief - "Closed or open source doesn't matter."

There are good and legitimate reasons why this May matter to some, and it is not always about Free. I have paid and continue to pay for OSS. I choose OSS sometimes because I like to, and SOMETIMES the project I'm working on demands it for Licensing reasons.

 

For what it's worth, Emby is listed all over the place (other sites) as OSS, including on github and the first page of the emby wiki. This MAY matter. Deal Breaker? not necessarily, but I'm happy that @@chowbok brought it up here as I have not yet dug around in the repos...

 

Luke and Devs, I'm not questioning your decisions... I'm sure you have reasons to structure things however they end up. Hopefully you all have been open and honest about the future, that's all we can ask. (this is coming from someone who is in the midst of a bad breakup with a closed project) But it is up to the individual to decide if Open Source Matters (sorry Joomla!) Because to some of us it really does. 

 

OK, Flame suit done up, back to figuring out how to get my new library scanning...

[Jucgshu 5]

Emby being foss is one of the very reasons I even considered it in the first place.

 

That sure *would* be a deal breaker to me.

 

Sadly.

[Luke 37295]

Emby being foss is one of the very reasons I even considered it in the first place.

 

That sure *would* be a deal breaker to me.

 

Sadly.

 

Does our hard work, dedication, and responsiveness to user feedback help sway you at all?

[One2Go 98]

Just went through the Reddit thread and have to agree with many who don't care if it is open or closed. We are willing to monetarily support convenience of our playback solutions if it does what is promised and what we expect I don't care if it is open or closed.

 

Interesting interview of Luke on linux.com.

https://www.linux.com/news/exclusive-interview-emby-founder-luke-pulverenti

 

Is Emby server fully open source? If yes, what license are you using and why did you choose it to make open source?

Emby Server is fully open source under GPL V2.0. Anyone can run from source and be up and running in a matter of minutes. It's important to mention though that our goal is to produce the best experience we possibly can. If an agreement with a potential partner were to require us to make certain modules closed source, then we would not hesitate to do that. These situations are reserved for standalone, optional features and will not prevent running the core server from source.

 

@@chowbok

The possibility to go closed has been on the record since September 28, 2015 and was not buried in some obscure location.

Edited December 9, 2018 by One2Go

[Deathsquirrel 741]

I've never looked at the source and I've been using this product since it was Media Browser 2 and built around WMC.  From the stats on Github, nobody else is using that source access either.  If closing some of the source code is required to support some new functions I say go for it.

 

Of course I don't consider source access a moral issue.  I know some do.

[Jucgshu 5]

Does our hard work, dedication, and responsiveness to user feedback help sway you at all?

No doubt about those @@Luke of course. I rarely saw someone that dedicated anwsering user boards. And Emby is a wonderful piece of software I love to use.

 

I sure hope you'll find a way to stay foss and earn enough money while doing it.

 

I'd be so sad to leave all that.

[daedalus 430]

Is Emby server fully open source? If yes, what license are you using and why did you choose it to make open source?

Emby Server is fully open source under GPL V2.0. Anyone can run from source and be up and running in a matter of minutes. It's important to mention though that our goal is to produce the best experience we possibly can. If an agreement with a potential partner were to require us to make certain modules closed source, then we would not hesitate to do that. These situations are reserved for standalone, optional features and will not prevent running the core server from source.

^ isn't that the more important part of the citation, cause the core will now be locked down?

 

 

@@chowbok

The possibility to go closed has been on the record since September 28, 2015 and was not buried in some obscure location.

the citation says "to make certain modules closed source" and not the core

 

don't want to heat this up, just want to understand

[Happy2Play 8377]

 

No, if you check out our recent announcement, we now have additions that are costing us money. We cannot open source that. Instead we are modularizing and open sourcing as many standalone components as we possibly can.

https://github.com/MediaBrowser/Emby/issues/3479

[CBers 6806]

I can't believe this is being raised again.

 

The devs can decide whatever they want to do with their software.

 

If it was open-source and is no longer and you don't like that, then go and use something else.

 

Most people are more than happy to pay for Emby and to compensate the devs for their work and hours of dedication they put in, even when we don't always agree with some of their decisions, but that's what makes Emby a joy to be part of.

 

So to sum up, if you don't like what's happened, then go elsewhere.

 

If you don't care either way, then stick around and enjoy the Emby experience.

 

At the end of the day, we use Emby to watch content, not bitch about licencing.

[daedalus 430]

https://github.com/MediaBrowser/Emby/issues/3479

 

that's not answering my question

 

sry didn't read carefully it's answered here https://github.com/MediaBrowser/Emby/issues/3479#issuecomment-444990184

 

in fact this is the exact opposite now, closed core, not able to run core from source, an "some" open modules

or am i wrong with this ?

Edited December 10, 2018 by daedalus

[One2Go 98]

Emby being foss is one of the very reasons I even considered it in the first place.

 

That sure *would* be a deal breaker to me.

 

Sadly.

 

 

^ isn't that the more important part of the citation, cause the core will now be locked down?

 

 

the citation says "to make certain modules closed source" and not the core

 

don't want to heat this up, just want to understand

 

Here are a few points made by FluffyDroid in the Reddit thread:

When some parts of the core became closed some people actually tried to start a few forks.

Now a couple of months later, I can't find a single one that has any recent activity.

 

Here's one, zero activity since august:

https://github.com/joshuaboniface/Emby/commits/master

 

Considering the amount of contributions on Github by other developers....yeah, a fork won't happen, and if it happens, it won't be maintained for very long.

 

 

Answering the question by one poster "can't we just fork and maintain the current release ourselves?"

Sure. But who will spend countless hours on this project for free? Will you do that? Nothing stops you. Just go ahead and clone the project on Github and get going.

 

Give it a new name, setup a website, build a community and find other like minded developers willing to work 100% for free on a project that requires constant maintenance.

 

First step will be to develop clients and port the server for/to X amount of TV brands, X amount of NAS brands, X amount of operating systems and Android+Android TV+iOS+ATV and Xbox.

 

You will have to sign license agreements with LG, Samsung, Microsoft, some of the NAS brands etc. to provide the software via the official app repositories. You will have to open a developer account with Apple, Google etc. You will have to maintain and upload new packages to all of these services on a regular basis.

 

At the same time you will have to both squash bugs and maintain all of the plugins hooking in with third party services, and develop new features.

 

I get a headache even thinking about what a hellish horror it must be to maintain both Emby server and the client for all of those platforms. Amazed that they're still in business while being able to offer support for such a broad array of devices/platforms.

 

Never thought of how much is involved in keeping Emby running and competitive. I tip my hat.

Edited December 10, 2018 by One2Go

[Luke 37295]

Yes it is a massive effort. We work pretty tirelessly. That's why it can be a little disheartening when we see all these forks that don't have any activity other than removing the license checks.

[One2Go 98]

You have to concentrate on the users that are willing to support you and that will follow your product vision. If they don't like something then they will voice it but you are offering a product and service that many of us are willing to financially support. Ignore those that feel if it is on the Internet is should be free. Time is any person's most valuable asset and I doubt that if you as a developer are lying on your dying bed will say "I wish I could have spent a few more hours coding and posting" I bet you it would be more like "I wish I could have spent a few more hours with my family". Allocate your time to what you deem important.

[chowbok 77]

I can't believe this is being raised again.

 

The devs can decide whatever they want to do with their software.

 

If it was open-source and is no longer and you don't like that, then go and use something else.

 

Most people are more than happy to pay for Emby and to compensate the devs for their work and hours of dedication they put in, even when we don't always agree with some of their decisions, but that's what makes Emby a joy to be part of.

 

So to sum up, if you don't like what's happened, then go elsewhere.

 

If you don't care either way, then stick around and enjoy the Emby experience.

 

At the end of the day, we use Emby to watch content, not bitch about licencing.

You're missing the point, or my point at any rate. Of course the devs can do what they want with their code. What they can't do, or at least shouldn't, is advertise a product as open source, promote on that basis, and then go to closed-source without making it clear that's what happened. There are many people that used and supported Emby based on the license and they deserve to be informed that that's changed. Luke & co. should have made a post about this in the forums or in the blog, not try to sweep it under the rug. It's disheartening that even mentioning this gets responses like yours, which amount to "shut up and go away".

Edited December 10, 2018 by chowbok