Best solution for Direct Playing HD MKV's

[Harblar 29]

So, I'm really just curious as of right now what the best options for this are, outside of Emby Theater/HTPC.

 

Ultimately, I'm talking about the best solution to get an MKV (1:1 rip from a DVD, HD-DVD, or Blu-Ray) to direct play and bitstream it's original audio track to a high end Home theater setup. (I want the video to be decoded/processed and played by dedicated hardware. I want the Lossless audio track to be passed through and decoded by a highend audio processor. It has to be able to support embedded or external subtitles. It also has to support 3D MKV with embedded MVC tracks). 

 

Right now I have an HTPC setup and running the new Emby Theater (which is working great right now and seems to get better with each release!) What doesn't work great is the fact that it's still an HTPC and I still have to have a keyboard/mouse around, as well as dealing with all the issues any normal PC would have.  Blu-Ray MKV's look good when auto frame rate detection is on, but everything else doesn't  always look as good or flow as well. Unless you invest in the hardware to really go nuts with MadrVR, there seems to be a limit as to how much you can do versus a dedicated player. My old Oppo BDP-83 Blu-ray player absolutely blows my HTPC out of the water when it comes to handling plain old DVD's. I even see a bit of a bump in the quality of Blu-rays. I'm sure the difference would be even more noticeable on a 103d/105d. 

 

So... are there any apps/hardware out there that act like emby theater (direct play) yet can deliver playback of mkv's similar to a dedicated high-end disc player?  Any chance of a dedicated Oppo app (or porting an android one over if possible... Honestly, I have no idea what kind of os Oppo uses for it's apps or if they allow 3rd party apps in the first place. Just curious.)

 

What about via DLNA and the use of a mobile device as the media browser (no pun intended! :-) It seems pretty much any one of the mobile apps has the ability to play to any other client the server can see.  I know the 103d/105d's are capable of streaming and decoding pretty much any kind of MKV disc rip (even 3d MVC MKV's). The only thing they really lack is a built in Emby interface for browsing the media. Has anyone tried this by using, say, an iPad to select and then direct play media on an Oppo (or any other dedicated players similar to that)?

 

Are there any other stand alone devices, with an Emby app, that are capable of this type of playback?

 

As of right now, I have a modest Home theater setup and everything works good for my needs. Within the next year, I'm planning to build a dedicated home theater room with an emphasis on high quality playback (light controlled, 4k projection, dolby atmos, etc... within reason... budget allowing.) I want to be able to provide the highest quality source material and playback to the theater as I can, but I REALLY don't want to have to revert to loading an actual disc and dealing with all the BS that entails. That means a decent streaming option of my MKV's. So what all is everyone else with a dedicated theater using?  :-)

[MSattler 387]

So, I'm really just curious as of right now what the best options for this are, outside of Emby Theater/HTPC.

 

Ultimately, I'm talking about the best solution to get an MKV (1:1 rip from a DVD, HD-DVD, or Blu-Ray) to direct play and bitstream it's original audio track to a high end Home theater setup. (I want the video to be decoded/processed and played by dedicated hardware. I want the Lossless audio track to be passed through and decoded by a highend audio processor. It has to be able to support embedded or external subtitles. It also has to support 3D MKV with embedded MVC tracks). 

 

Right now I have an HTPC setup and running the new Emby Theater (which is working great right now and seems to get better with each release!) What doesn't work great is the fact that it's still an HTPC and I still have to have a keyboard/mouse around, as well as dealing with all the issues any normal PC would have.  Blu-Ray MKV's look good when auto frame rate detection is on, but everything else doesn't  always look as good or flow as well. Unless you invest in the hardware to really go nuts with MadrVR, there seems to be a limit as to how much you can do versus a dedicated player. My old Oppo BDP-83 Blu-ray player absolutely blows my HTPC out of the water when it comes to handling plain old DVD's. I even see a bit of a bump in the quality of Blu-rays. I'm sure the difference would be even more noticeable on a 103d/105d. 

 

So... are there any apps/hardware out there that act like emby theater (direct play) yet can deliver playback of mkv's similar to a dedicated high-end disc player?  Any chance of a dedicated Oppo app (or porting an android one over if possible... Honestly, I have no idea what kind of os Oppo uses for it's apps or if they allow 3rd party apps in the first place. Just curious.)

 

What about via DLNA and the use of a mobile device as the media browser (no pun intended! :-) It seems pretty much any one of the mobile apps has the ability to play to any other client the server can see.  I know the 103d/105d's are capable of streaming and decoding pretty much any kind of MKV disc rip (even 3d MVC MKV's). The only thing they really lack is a built in Emby interface for browsing the media. Has anyone tried this by using, say, an iPad to select and then direct play media on an Oppo (or any other dedicated players similar to that)?

 

Are there any other stand alone devices, with an Emby app, that are capable of this type of playback?

 

As of right now, I have a modest Home theater setup and everything works good for my needs. Within the next year, I'm planning to build a dedicated home theater room with an emphasis on high quality playback (light controlled, 4k projection, dolby atmos, etc... within reason... budget allowing.) I want to be able to provide the highest quality source material and playback to the theater as I can, but I REALLY don't want to have to revert to loading an actual disc and dealing with all the BS that entails. That means a decent streaming option of my MKV's. So what all is everyone else with a dedicated theater using?  :-)

 

RPI2's with Kodi / Emby Plugin will do MVC, and direct play your HD mkv's, however you won't get TrueHD or DTSHD, but it can bit stream lossless to your receiver.

 

If mvc is not a requirement pick a NUC, or even a J1900 powered player and put Kodi / Emby Plugin on it.

[Deathsquirrel 741]

With those requirements your options are EMC, ET, and Kodi.

[Harblar 29]

however you won't get TrueHD or DTSHD, but it can bit stream lossless to your receiver.

 

So does that mean it will or won't bitstream TrueHD/ATMOS/DTSHD?

 

Basically what I'm aiming at is that the client must:

 

1.) Require no transcoding of MKV's created from any commercially available disc format (including MVC encoded blu-ray's)

2.) Must passthrough/bitstream all Audio codecs (or pass along unaltered Multi-channel PCM if present) that exist on any commercially available disc format

3.) Must be able to handle video processing necessary to present a video image comparable to or better than a typical mid range HTPC. (must be capable of Frame rate matching, deinterlacing, upscaling, and pulldown)

4.) Video files can either be accessed/browsed via a built in client app or Played to remotely via DLNA and a second client app

 

I know Rasberry pi/Kodi is capable of playing 1080p video, but I have trouble believing it can deliver a better/smoother/crisper playback performance than a Darbee edition Oppo disc player. Sure, a RPi2 is a tenth the price and would work just fine for most 1080p plasmas, but I am looking to setup a dedicated theater with a mid-highend 4k (or psuedo 4k) capable projector. One projector I am seriously considering is the Epson LS10000 (or maybe a midrange priced native 4k sony or jvc). I want to be able to deliver the best picture I possibly can to such a display and I have doubts that a RPi2 will be able to fully do that any better than the HTPC I already have.

 

At $40 I'm willing to give it a try, if for nothing more than curiosity's sake, but in the end I'm going to want something with a bit more heft when it comes to video processing, enhancement, and playback.

[Harblar 29]

With those requirements your options are EMC, ET, and Kodi.

 

From a strict software standpoint, those are probably the best (most reliable) options. Even Plex has direct play abilities, depending on the apps. I'm primarily asking what Hardware has the capability of handling these needs, natively. Of the devices that can, which could potentially play well with Emby?

 

I know for a fact that, the Oppo will stream and handle MKV rips just fine via it's built in network browser (though probably not as pretty or with any of the metadata one would get with Emby). What I don't know is whether or not it will play nice with Emby via Remote Playto commands from any one of the standard Emby Mobile Clients (or even the web interface, for that matter). It should be possible to setup a DLNA profile in Emby server for this, shouldn't it? (What about other set top players with MKV support? I'm pretty sure Samsung has a few... maybe others?) 

 

I get it... Most people using Emby don't care about maintaining 1:1 quality mkv's and playing them back at the highest possible level of quality. Most are just looking for maximum viewing compatibility across multiple devices at an affordable price (which is great), but it seems like more and more often video/audiophile grade quality tends to fall by the wayside in favor of convenience. This is pretty evident in the movie industry as a whole. Heck, I went to Deadpool at my local Carmike theater tonight. Everyone there seemed to be enjoying it, but the one thing that kept irritating the hell out of me was the fact that my small 5.1 system at home could do a much clearer and louder job of presenting the audio than this commercial theater could. $12 for a ticket and the movie, at it's most intense points, wasn't much louder than normal conversation levels. Pile on top of it the fact that there "fancy" DLP digital projectors weren't focused properly resulting in a blurry near impossible to read credit scroll. Pitiful... (granted, a week ago I was out in San Francisco and saw the Force Awakens on one of the best screens in the world. everything looks and sounds like crap after that! lol)

 

Still... I'm picky when it comes to my setup and really take pride in making it look and sound the best that I can. I want to be that guy that makes their friends hate themselves for actually going to the local cinema. }:-)

 

All I'm looking for is a higher end solution, that is more streamlined/user friendly than an HTPC.

 

I did some looking and came across this explanation of bitstreaming on the RPi2. Basically... limited at best, though capable of decoding and outputting lossless pcm. Not my preference since I know my preamp will do a much cleaner and more efficient job of it. Terrific that it can handle all of that in a $40 package and would have been exactly what I was looking for even 5 years ago, but it doesn't meet my full needs now... at least not for a dedicated theater. (would work great as a streaming box to TV/Soundbars in remote areas of the house/shop/etc...)

[ebr 14960]

If you really still have HD-DVDs I'd be looking to convert those puppies .

[Deathsquirrel 741]

I can't speak to DLNA capabilities of a given device.  You'd have to check with the manufacturer.  I don't use DLNA if I can possibly avoid it.

 

The only Emby clients that support the features you're looking for are the PC-based ones, EMC, ET, and Kodi.Since you want 3D support and higher end rendering functions found in MadVR you're currently going to have to choose between EMC and Kodi since the new version of ET doesn't support external players yet.

[Harblar 29]

If you really still have HD-DVDs I'd be looking to convert those puppies .

 

I've only got like 15-20, but I ripped them to MKV a long time ago. For the most part, they play back very similar to Blu-ray and tend to use similar codecs. They encode at 30fps and use pulldown to give the original 24fps. I used to see the occasional choppy playback with this when auto frame rate would detect them as 24hz, but something in the codecs must have gotten tweaked at some point cause they all playback smooth at 24hz now. The only real issue I've ever had has been getting the embeded subtitles to work, but SRT's seem to fix that just fine. ;-)

 

Deathsquirrel, I get exactly what your saying, but you seem to be missing my point.  I'm currently running a midrange HTPC with a GTX560 and Emby Theater. I don't have a 3d capable display and only have around 10 3D movies (so not mission critical for me at this point). When I build my dedicated theater I'll likely readdress 3D and be looking for a more viable solution. (external players are not my favorite option because they seem like a real step backwards)  For the higher end rendering functions of MadVR one would be looking at a fairly healthy bump in graphics power (maybe in overall pc performance in general) to max it out. At this point, we're talking quite a bit of money ($1500-2000 or more for a top end rig) and still having to deal with a os/frontend interface (drivers, windows updates, bla, bla bla...) vs a $500 set top box solely dedicated and designed for video playback.

 

You're not a fan of DLNA (understandable), but that's really what this post is about. Trying to figure out exactly what highend hardware solutions currently exist that could be used with a remote Emby client as a frontend, is. Or even which of these devices might be able to have a client app developed for them (3rd party apps via an appstore like roku, fire tv, etc...)  There seems to be little discussion of it on these boards, but I think it's an area that needs to be addressed. Maybe not by the programming and development team (at least not right away), but from the end user side of things. Maybe setup a board where we can test and try various streaming devices, report our various results, and agree on what is needed to obtain the absolute best PQ in the most efficient manner. That's all I'm getting at. :-)

[Deathsquirrel 741]

OK, good luck then.  In my experience DLNA is, at best, an afterthought and the playback quality is unreliable and poor.  I'd suggest posting in the DLNA forums if you're looking for a DLNA play-to target that can handle high bit rates and HD audio formats.  If it exists and anyone here knows about it they're likely to be posting there.

 

--Edit: when I say afterthought I'm referring to the device manufacturers.  On the Emby side it's never been a problem but the playback device experience typically sucks.

Edited February 16, 2016 by Deathsquirrel

[Harblar 29]

OK, good luck then.  In my experience DLNA is, at best, an afterthought and the playback quality is unreliable and poor.  I'd suggest posting in the DLNA forums if you're looking for a DLNA play-to target that can handle high bit rates and HD audio formats.  If it exists and anyone here knows about it they're likely to be posting there.

 

--Edit: when I say afterthought I'm referring to the device manufacturers.  On the Emby side it's never been a problem but the playback device experience typically sucks.

 

I hear ya.  DLNA isn't ideal, to be sure, but I think it's about the only (currently) viable route for highend dedicated Hardware.  Honestly... I'd snatch up an Oppo BDP-103 to mess around with and report back, but I'm hesitant for a couple of reasons. First off, I'd like to know if anyone else has managed to setup a profile for it in Emby Server and if they've managed to sucessfully direct play to it through mobile (ios, android, windows phone, etc...) client apps. Secondly, Oppo hasn't released a new player in a few years and with UHD Players about to hit the market, I'm reluctant to plunk down $500 on a Bluray player when I could potentially put that towards a new Oppo UHD player with even better streaming capabilities sometime later this year.

 

I looked on a few other forums to see how people were handling MKV rips and it's surprising how little there really is out there. Everything is either geared for ease of use (nice browsing frontends), streaming, and max combatibility (transcoding) or you have to be using physical media (disc or memory stick) and/or browsing network folders looking for specific files.  As you said earlier, ET, EMC, and Kodi really are the only viable options that bridge both camps. (with out a lot of potential fiddling/coding/etc...)

 

With storage continuing to get larger and cheaper I'm amazed no one has just developed an "MKV Box" with an Emby like OS solely dedicated to playing back 1:1 DVD/BluRay rips at full bitrate, lossless audio, subs, and 3d. Throw in some decent hardware for video processing and potential upscaling to a nice 4k output and you'd be set! It wouldn't be an all-in-one solution, but it would Excel at exactly what it was designed to do! Here's our box. Here's Exactly how to rip, store, and access your media with our box. I can imagine a lot of people with dedicated high end setups being interested in such a device... oh well.