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New server/NAS need your thoughts and opinions please


chrismallia

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chrismallia

Hi all.

I am currently running a server I build a couple of years ago that is running Ubuntu 18.04  with ZFS, 6 4tB wd RED drives in RaidZ 2. I also am running  docker with several apps like emby,reverse   proxy and more. This build is aging and I need a new setup and here is where I cant decide :), I am in between building a new server  with Intel I3 8110,32GB Ram that  amounts around $655  or go with a synology ds1019+ around $800 (these are the prices in my country). Cons of ds1019+ much lower specs with 5bay no 10G nic support and 1 of the most thing that bothers me is that I would have to install emby and store its metadata and transcodes on the pool, in my current setup emby is on an SSD and has all metadata and transcodes there..

 

What would you guys do?? :) 

 

Thanks for all your  opinions 

 

 

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mediacowboy

I'm all about custom. Gives you more control over what you can do.

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Q-Droid

Price and performance...there's your answer. You already know how to build a server, manage storage and Docker. Going with turnkey is a step backwards.

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mastrmind11

Price and performance...there's your answer. You already know how to build a server, manage storage and Docker. Going with turnkey is a step backwards.

100%.  These prebuilt NAS boxes are a complete waste of money.

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SHSPVR

Hi all.

I am currently running a server I build a couple of years ago that is running Ubuntu 18.04  with ZFS, 6 4tB wd RED drives in RaidZ 2. I also am running  docker with several apps like emby,reverse   proxy and more. This build is aging and I need a new setup and here is where I cant decide :), I am in between building a new server  with Intel I3 8110,32GB Ram that  amounts around $655  or go with a synology ds1019+ around $800 (these are the prices in my country). Cons of ds1019+ much lower specs with 5bay no 10G nic support and 1 of the most thing that bothers me is that I would have to install emby and store its metadata and transcodes on the pool, in my current setup emby is on an SSD and has all metadata and transcodes there..

 

What would you guys do?? :)

 

Thanks for all your  opinions 

 

I would skip the WD Red 2TB thru 6TB those are SMR drives unless it an 8TB or high or it the Pro model

 

Here my build

Antec Performance Series P101 Silent Black/0.8 mm SPCC ATX Mid Tower Case with 8 x 3.5" HDD / 2.5" SSD Removable Bays (Why I chose this case it has 8 bay and hot swap bay are to darn expensive and I need to be more desktop style case)

Corsair CX Series CX750 (New) CP-9020123-NA 750W ATX12V 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Non-Modular Active PFC Power Supply

Intel Core i3-9100 Coffee Lake 4-Core 3.6 GHz(4.2 GHz Turbo) LGA 1151 (300 Series) 65W BX80684I39100 Desktop Processor

MSI B360 GAMING PLUS LGA 1151 (300 Series) Intel B360 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 ATX Intel Motherboard

G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2666 (PC4 21300) Desktop Memory Model F4-2666C15D-16GVR

Corsair Hydro Series, H60 2018 (CW-9060036-WW), 120mm Radiator, Single 120mm PWM Fan, Liquid CPU Cooler

LG Black Blu-ray Burner SATA WH16NS40

Seagate BarraCuda 510 M.2 2280 256GB PCIe G3 x4, NVMe 1.3 3D TLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) ZP256CM30041 (Bootdrive)

Used LSI SAS 9211-8i 8-port 6Gb/s Internal IT-MODE and cables (I plan to update and replace drive to 8TB hard drive across the board I have reused what I got for now)

4x Seagate IronWolf ST8000VN004 8TB 7200 RPM 256MB Cache SATA (With plans to add 4 more over of this year)

USB 2.0 4 Ports PCI Slot Bracket

Re-used Hauppauge WinTV quad-HD

Re-used other Hauppauge device

Re-used Hauppauge USB HD-PVR 2 and PCIe Colossus 2

Re-used 128GB SSD for Caching Transcoding temporary path

 

I hope to have this up and running next week when drives come it ouch cost fortune but it should last another 10 year LoL

Edited by SHSPVR
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Jdiesel

I would skip the WD Red 1TB thru 6TB those are SMR drives unless it an 8TB or high or it the Pro model

 

I found the 8TB drives to be the sweet spot for TB/$

 

 

Isn't the SMR issue a bit overblown for those who aren't continuously writing a lot of data to the drive? I've read for applications like media servers they are just fine.

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SHSPVR

I found the 8TB drives to be the sweet spot for TB/$

 

 

Isn't the SMR issue a bit overblown for those who aren't continuously writing a lot of data to the drive? I've read for applications like media servers they are just fine.

 

Not from what I read and experience my self with my gaming system and Seagate Barracuda 8TB model ST8000DM004 with a steam game library on it and how they work they fine as read only data that get written once as reg HBA or Archival storage in a non raid setup

Edited by SHSPVR
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mediacowboy

I believe smr is good for warm drives. Write once read a lot.

 

I have used Seagate archive and I know those are smr drives. Writing a bunch of data to them took forever but reading multiple streams they didn't have a problem.

 

I should note that I used them in a drive pool configuration versus a raid.

Edited by mediacowboy
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mediacowboy

Hi all.

I am currently running a server I build a couple of years ago that is running Ubuntu 18.04 with ZFS, 6 4tB wd RED drives in RaidZ 2. I also am running docker with several apps like emby,reverse proxy and more. This build is aging and I need a new setup and here is where I cant decide :), I am in between building a new server with Intel I3 8110,32GB Ram that amounts around $655 or go with a synology ds1019+ around $800 (these are the prices in my country). Cons of ds1019+ much lower specs with 5bay no 10G nic support and 1 of the most thing that bothers me is that I would have to install emby and store its metadata and transcodes on the pool, in my current setup emby is on an SSD and has all metadata and transcodes there..

 

What would you guys do?? :)

 

Thanks for all your opinions

After thinking on this more I would do 16GB of ram and spend a little more on an i5 processor. You didn't say what format your media is in so I assume it will direct play internal but if you want to stream externally you want a little more processor for conversion.

 

 

My build currently:

Node 804

ASRock H170M-ITX/DL LGA 1151

Intel Core i5-6500

G.SKILL Aegis 16GB (2 x 8GB)

LSI-9211 (IT Mode)

WD Blue 250 GB

WD Blue 2 TB

7 Seagate Ironwolf 8TB

Nortek HUSBAB-1 

 

OS: Ubuntu 18.07 LTS

 

MergerFS for drivepooling the IronWolfs

OS is on the 250 GB

2TB is Misc

 

I am running the following docker containers on this with no problem:

 

Admin Software:

  • Portainer
  • Watchtower
  • Heimdall
  • LetsEncrypt - SSL/Reverse Proxy

  • Unifi Controller

Media Software:

  • Emby
  • LazyLibrarian
  • Jackett
  • Lidarr
  • Radarr
  • Sonarr
  • SabNZBd
  • Ombi
  • Deluge

Home Automation:

  • Home Assistant
  • influxdb-grafana - Not currenlty doing anything as I am rebuilding my Home Assistant setup
  • mqtt
  • Heimdall

Oh and a SilcionDust HDHomeRun Prime for live TV. That my wife says we have to have.

Edited by mediacowboy
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SHSPVR

After thinking on this more I would do 16GB of ram and spend a little more on an i5 processor. You didn't say what format your media is in so I assume it will direct play internal but if you want to stream externally you want a little more processor for conversion.

 

But the cheapest one have no GPU and didn't factor that in to over cost unless he or she one and wouldn't QuickSync be better over all option for mobile device for transcoding

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mediacowboy

But the cheapest one have no GPU and didn't factor that in to over cost unless he or she one and wouldn't QuickSync be better over all option for mobile device for transcoding

 

That is why I said save the money on the ram and look at a i5 processor. They have GPU for quicksync.

 

What they posted. Couldn't find the 8110.

What I had in mind. same gpu but a little more processor for the other apps.

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Q-Droid

The OP didn't share the specs for their current server or if they wanted to keep the existing box for something else. If not then all that's needed is a motherboard swap + CPU and RAM. Keep the current drives as they are and boot the new hardware with the existing OS and software. Then there's not need to reinstall, reconfigure or move data. The i3 is good and sure an i5 is better but for the best media support it should be 8th or 9th gen, nothing older than that.

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SHSPVR

That is why I said save the money on the ram and look at a i5 processor. They have GPU for quicksync.

 

What they posted. Couldn't find the 8110.

What I had in mind. same gpu but a little more processor for the other apps.

Most like he or she could be ref to 8100

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mediacowboy

The OP didn't share the specs for their current server or if they wanted to keep the existing box for something else. If not then all that's needed is a motherboard swap + CPU and RAM. Keep the current drives as they are and boot the new hardware with the existing OS and software. Then there's not need to reinstall, reconfigure or move data. The i3 is good and sure an i5 is better but for the best media support it should be 8th or 9th gen, nothing older than that.

This is very true and would save a lot of money. Rough guess looking at what maybe $400.

$100 - RAM

$200 - CPU

$100 - Mother Board

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chrismallia

Hi guys,

Sorry for the very late reply, I posted this and went to bed lol.

The CPU is  I3 8100,  sorry my mistake in the first post it has Intel Quick sync but will also look at the I5, went for 32GB Ram because I use ZFS that is great but has its con that you cant expend unless you replace all the drives, my current system is very low end, 

CPU dual core g2030

8Gb Ram

HP PCIE 3.0 raid controller  that I flashed to IT Mode

Tower case.

 I have rack mounted all my Network stuff so I am changing the case for a 4u Rackmount, so do not have any plans for the old box.

Drives I bought over a year ago, so I do not know if they are SMR but when upgrading I would go with the seagate. SMR is bad when rebuilding a raid as it creates pausing problems.

Intel i3-8100 
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chrismallia

I would skip the WD Red 1TB thru 6TB those are SMR drives unless it an 8TB or high or it the Pro model

 

Here my build

Antec Performance Series P101 Silent Black/0.8 mm SPCC ATX Mid Tower Case with 8 x 3.5" HDD / 2.5" SSD Removable Bays (Why I chose this case it has 8 bay and hot swap bay are to darn expensive and I need to be more desktop style case)

Corsair CX Series CX750 (New) CP-9020123-NA 750W ATX12V 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Non-Modular Active PFC Power Supply

Intel Core i3-9100 Coffee Lake 4-Core 3.6 GHz(4.2 GHz Turbo) LGA 1151 (300 Series) 65W BX80684I39100 Desktop Processor

MSI B360 GAMING PLUS LGA 1151 (300 Series) Intel B360 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 ATX Intel Motherboard

G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2666 (PC4 21300) Desktop Memory Model F4-2666C15D-16GVR

Corsair Hydro Series, H60 2018 (CW-9060036-WW), 120mm Radiator, Single 120mm PWM Fan, Liquid CPU Cooler

LG Black Blu-ray Burner SATA WH16NS40

Seagate BarraCuda 510 M.2 2280 256GB PCIe G3 x4, NVMe 1.3 3D TLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) ZP256CM30041 (Bootdrive)

Used LSI SAS 9211-8i 8-port 6Gb/s Internal IT-MODE and cables (I plan to update and replace drive to 8TB hard drive across the board I have reused what I got for now)

4x Seagate IronWolf ST8000VN004 8TB 7200 RPM 256MB Cache SATA (With plans to add 4 more over of this year)

USB 2.0 4 Ports PCI Slot Bracket

Re-used Hauppauge WinTV quad-HD

Re-used other Hauppauge device

Re-used Hauppauge USB HD-PVR 2 and PCIe Colossus 2

Re-used 128GB SSD for Caching Transcoding temporary path

 

I hope to have this up and running next week when drives come it ouch cost fortune but it should last another 10 year LoL

 

Thanks for sharing. What are you using as OS and storage solution? Also anyone using dual parity (raid6 raidz 2) for there media? I sometimes wonder if losing 2 drives to parity is worth it. 

Edited by chrismallia
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chrismallia

The OP didn't share the specs for their current server or if they wanted to keep the existing box for something else. If not then all that's needed is a motherboard swap + CPU and RAM. Keep the current drives as they are and boot the new hardware with the existing OS and software. Then there's not need to reinstall, reconfigure or move data. The i3 is good and sure an i5 is better but for the best media support it should be 8th or 9th gen, nothing older than that.

Your correct.  All I need is the CPU Board and Ram, will also be changing case as its a tower that has no sides lol and is a little damaged :)

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chrismallia

After thinking on this more I would do 16GB of ram and spend a little more on an i5 processor. You didn't say what format your media is in so I assume it will direct play internal but if you want to stream externally you want a little more processor for conversion.

 

 

My build currently:

Node 804

ASRock H170M-ITX/DL LGA 1151

Intel Core i5-6500

G.SKILL Aegis 16GB (2 x 8GB)

LSI-9211 (IT Mode)

WD Blue 250 GB

WD Blue 2 TB

7 Seagate Ironwolf 8TB

Nortek HUSBAB-1 

 

OS: Ubuntu 18.07 LTS

 

MergerFS for drivepooling the IronWolfs

OS is on the 250 GB

2TB is Misc

 

I am running the following docker containers on this with no problem:

 

Admin Software:

  • Portainer
  • Watchtower
  • Heimdall
  • LetsEncrypt - SSL/Reverse Proxy

  • Unifi Controller

Media Software:

  • Emby
  • LazyLibrarian
  • Jackett
  • Lidarr
  • Radarr
  • Sonarr
  • SabNZBd
  • Ombi
  • Deluge

Home Automation:

  • Home Assistant
  • influxdb-grafana - Not currenlty doing anything as I am rebuilding my Home Assistant setup
  • mqtt
  • Heimdall

Oh and a SilcionDust HDHomeRun Prime for live TV. That my wife says we have to have.

Thanks for sharing,  ever tried out ZFS on ubuntu? what made you go with  MergerFS ? 

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mastrmind11

Thanks for sharing,  ever tried out ZFS on ubuntu? what made you go with  MergerFS ? 

I am currently running ZFS on my ubuntu NAS.  Its a fantastic filesystem.  You would choose mergerFS so that you can pool your drives easily and not have to worry about differing disk sizes.  With ZFS you need to match (or exceed) disk size in any vdev.  But for fult tolerance ZFS is the way to go.  I run 10x2 drive mirrors, which means I can lose 1 drive in each vdev before I lose my data.  

 

Regarding WD Reds, I've been running 2TB - 8TB drives for many years without issue.  Seagate on the other hand.... I lost 3 drives in 2 years and they were from different lots, which is pretty unacceptable.

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SHSPVR

Thanks for sharing. What are you using as OS and storage solution? Also anyone using dual parity (raid6 raidz 2) for there media? I sometimes wonder if losing 2 drives to parity is worth it. 

 

Has to be Windows being as there no support with USB/PCI/PCIe OTA Tuner and USB HD-PVR 2 or PCIe Colossus 2 with USB-UIRT IR Blaster under Linux with Emby I could use NextPVR Linux with M3U Tuner for OTA Tuner like I do now but I still have no analogue capture and I mostly likely be adding Drive Bender to mix, why is because of the limitation with Emby DVR recording storage only support one drive when we need multiple recording drive support and better intelligent recording.

Sorry I know nothing about ZFS but what I know about it is just another storage pool software

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SHSPVR

I am currently running ZFS on my ubuntu NAS.  Its a fantastic filesystem.  You would choose mergerFS so that you can pool your drives easily and not have to worry about differing disk sizes.  With ZFS you need to match (or exceed) disk size in any vdev.  But for fult tolerance ZFS is the way to go.  I run 10x2 drive mirrors, which means I can lose 1 drive in each vdev before I lose my data.  

 

Regarding WD Reds, I've been running 2TB - 8TB drives for many years without issue.  Seagate on the other hand.... I lost 3 drives in 2 years and they were from different lots, which is pretty unacceptable.

 

Unless you have NAS Red pacifically the EFAX model 2TB thru 6TB you may never see the problem but should read this and keep in mind even Seagate and Toshiba are using SMR Tech

https://blocksandfiles.com/2020/04/14/wd-red-nas-drives-shingled-magnetic-recording/

https://blocksandfiles.com/2020/04/23/western-digital-blog-wd-red-nas-smr-drives-overuse/

 

Just wonder what Seagate Size and Model where they

I recommend reviewing this it very used full

https://rml527.blogspot.com/

Edited by SHSPVR
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Q-Droid

The drive makers are hurting themselves by doing this. Mixing technologies within product lines and not labeling the drives clearly is going to make people avoid the full line or even the brand. They are all being sneaky about this in their race to higher capacity while trying to keep consumers in the dark. They could create a new product line for SMR and guide people to the right usage for workload and application. Or stick to branding SMR for enterprise, cloud and archival use and leave consumer lines alone.

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chrismallia

Thanks all for your input and advice.

emby is great so glad I switched, also  you guys make it even better as a community,  I never thought I would get all this sincere feedback and help.

 

So thank you all hope to have more discussions with you :))

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chrismallia

Unless you have NAS Red pacifically the EFAX model 2TB thru 6TB you may never see the problem but should read this and keep in mind even Seagate and Toshiba are using SMR Tech

https://blocksandfiles.com/2020/04/14/wd-red-nas-drives-shingled-magnetic-recording/

https://blocksandfiles.com/2020/04/23/western-digital-blog-wd-red-nas-smr-drives-overuse/

 

Just wonder what Seagate Size and Model where they

I recommend reviewing this it very used full

https://rml527.blogspot.com/

Thanks for that. WD RED have to be PRO and seagate  must be ironwolf not to have SMR, THATS WHAT i FOUND OUT IF THE INFO IS CORRECT.

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chrismallia

The drive makers are hurting themselves by doing this. Mixing technologies within product lines and not labeling the drives clearly is going to make people avoid the full line or even the brand. They are all being sneaky about this in their race to higher capacity while trying to keep consumers in the dark. They could create a new product line for SMR and guide people to the right usage for workload and application. Or stick to branding SMR for enterprise, cloud and archival use and leave consumer lines alone.

Agree 

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