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When is next stable release due?


GhostRider

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GhostRider

Hi

 

How often is the stable release of Emby server updated? There are a couple of fixes in beta version I like but I am not keen on running the beta versions. Wondered how long I will have to wait for the next stable release.

 

 

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Hi.  This is not a question we can answer accurately because the answer is "when it is ready" :).  I can say we are closing in on it and chasing down the last few issues that need to be addressed as opposed to still working on new items.

 

Thanks.

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  • 3 weeks later...
GhostRider

Hi @@ebr

 

Appreciate software development is difficult to have fixed dates but Version 4.1.1.0 had 6 updates in it. The current beta has over 70. In the world of DevOps is there a way Emby could have more regular stable releases that fixed issues and have separate major updates to add new features?

 

Two months since the last stable release feels like a long time, proably because I am keen to get a couple of the fixes listed.

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This is a longer than usual dev period and generally we prefer to be around one month per release.

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Rosario Family

This is a longer than usual dev period and generally we prefer to be around one month per release.

Should I wait for the stable version or should I go with the beta? Do you know in how long is going to be ready?

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Happy2Play

Should I wait for the stable version or should I go with the beta? Do you know in how long is going to be ready?

 

Everyone's Emby usage is different so only you can decide if the beta release is a fit for you.  Really depends on if you need a fix now.  You are updating a lot more often on the beta branch, usually ever 3-5 days.  So you have to monitor every update to see if it breaks your system or not.

 

It is impossible to say how long a beta will be when new bug and current bug are being reported daily.

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Gilgamesh_48

I believe the current beta is ready for release BUT my usage is very simple.

 

While I have a large library I do not use live TV at all and I do ot use any remote functionality. I use Emby only for movies and TV and a large, but simple, photo library. That makes my usage very easy on server functionality so what I perceive as "ready for release" could be vastly different that what other users might perceive.

 

In my case I use the beta for my regular Emby usage. But I do keep a "regular" Emby server active as a backup, "just in case." I have not really had a serious problem for a very long time and that is why I think the beta is ready for release.

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NicCo

I hope it will be released soon because I think I have this issue solved in beta : 

  • Fix lan ip being lost after a period of time on Windows
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cptlores

The most important thing is to make sure stable is.. well stable releases. So take the time needed to make sure.

It is not that long ago that I had to turn of automatic updates because new 'stable' releases where coming out a bit fast and loose.

Edited by cptlores
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  • 3 weeks later...
GhostRider

This is a longer than usual dev period and generally we prefer to be around one month per release.

 

Hi @@Luke @@ebr,

 

Last stable release was on 30/04/19, there will always be some fixes in the pipeline. Any chance of a stable release being available soon please?

 

Is there a fix in the pipeline that addresses the gray boxes around CoverArt as reported here:

https://emby.media/community/index.php?/topic/71572-upgraded-to-v-403-have-some-problems/?p=719975

Edited by GhostRider
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CBers

Hi @@Luke @@ebr,

 

Last stable release was on 30/04/19, there will always be some fixes in the pipeline. Any chance of a stable release being available soon please?

 

Is there a fix in the pipeline that addresses the gray boxes around CoverArt as reported here:

https://emby.media/community/index.php?/topic/71572-upgraded-to-v-403-have-some-problems/?p=719975

It'll be released when it's been thoroughly tested in the beta environment.

 

You could always set up a separate beta server yourself and help test, then you wouldn't need to keep asking the same question :)

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  • 1 year later...
IronBeardKnight

Hi Guys,

I know people don't like this question asked but unfortunately their is a number of updates that have been released in beta for a while now that i'm keen to get my hands on to solve the issues i"m having, mainly transcoding color issues.

I do not intend to rush at all here just looking for a rough time frame of when we will see the next stable release for Emby Server as its been quite a long time since the last, almost 4 months now.

Understandably I could just move to the beta platform but its advised in many places that you should not switch between stable and beta as this can cause library and other issues, I should note that its also advised also that you should not have two separate instances of Emby running on the same library folder as this can also cause issues with corruption and file locking.

This puts me in a tough position as not all of us have said space to cater for duplicate libraries nor want to deal with recovery in worst case.

Given I'm a premium member If anyone has any safe solutions to take advantage of the much wanted updates without risk while we wait for the next stable release i would be eager to hear them please? otherwise do we have an eta for stable? :) 

Kindest Regards :)

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It's a "risk reward" type thing that only you can decide if it's worth it or not.

My thoughts are if you run Emby Server on a PC under Windows you might want to consider running the beta even on your main system.  Windows is by far the best tested of all versions simply because of the amount of people running Windows, plus it's the main development environment as well.  I can't remember the last time there was a show stopper in Beta.  If something does get broken it's quickly fixed with a new beta release.

You can always run the beta but turn off auto updates and just stay behind a bit like a couple of days to make sure no one else has discovered any major problems with a new release but they are usually just incremental things at the beta level compared to release versions anyway.

The latest beta 4.5.0.16 has been very stable to me.

Something to consider.

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IronBeardKnight

Thank you for the reply, I run it in a docker so thats out. Hmm running a few releases behind hahahaha should that not be where the stable version is supposed to be at ?.
 

I appreciate your insight on the latest beta release through. :)  My risk is too great to gamble with unfortunately so I will be waiting for the stable release I guess :(

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12 hours ago, IronBeardKnight said:

Thank you for the reply, I run it in a docker so thats out. Hmm running a few releases behind hahahaha should that not be where the stable version is supposed to be at ?.
 

I appreciate your insight on the latest beta release through. :)  My risk is too great to gamble with unfortunately so I will be waiting for the stable release I guess :(

I didn't say behind a couple of versions.  I said a couple of days.  :)

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IronBeardKnight
On 8/5/2020 at 10:28 AM, Luke said:

What version are you running now?

Currently running 4.4.3.0 stable. 

Here in Aus our internet upload is not great for the money and in most places you cannot get adequate download as well so I must transcode when I'm at a remote location, however when going from HDR to anything lower than transcoded to none hdr 4k makes the color almost completely disappear from  the transcoded media and becomes so washed out its hard to watch.

 

A little graph to get my point  out there

Bitrate declining respectively which you can imagine looses some information but  for HDR conversion it should not be at that level for color/tone mappings.

I believe you have fixed this in beta already :)

Quality scale: GTX1660

NONE HDR

                            Great---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->Watchable---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->terrible

         4k to 720p ---------------------------------------->  **

             to 1080p -------------------------->    **

                   to 4k ------------->    **

 

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

HDR

                            Great---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->Watchable---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->terrible

4k HDR to 720p -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->  **

            to 1080p ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->  **

                   to 4k ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->  **

 

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The fix for this is dual files (HDR & SDR)

4K/HDR for those ONLY who can direct play the media and 1080/720 for those who can't play 4K/HDR files.

Many of us with 4K media keep them in a 4K Movie Library just like we do 3D Movies with other movies in "Movies" which are normal 2D SDR.  Access to the 3D and 4K libraries are granted to only those users with 4K playback and adequate sound and video equipment to make use of the file properly.

HDR and SDR use different color spaces so they will look different. If you transcode an HDR file you're going to get the washed out looking video. Without dedicated hardware that could shift the colors in real time or better speed wise you don't stand a chance of using these files transcoded. Any type of "tone mapping" or color mapping will put a serious hurting on your CPU beyond just the difference in resolution that 4K brings to the table.  AND even if you could do this in real time your resulting file transcoded from 4K would likely be sub par to a good 1080p rip done specifically for that resolution and color space.

 

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IronBeardKnight

Its true i could have multiple files however this is not an adequate storage solution.

What is the point of having transcoding if it cannot be utilized for its intended purpose.

Colour mapping is understandably a tough nut to crack but believe me its possible with many many threads around the subject and many opensource solutions for different color spaces. Even the guys here at Emby have updated in the beta to better correct it.

 

Replying with just have multiple files is a cheap answer in my opinion when we already have plex that does it, tv's and blue-ray players that that convert for none compatible tv and many others.

I won't take away from your stated argument that its not going to be one to one however it could at least be .85 to 1 .

Even if your ripping from hdr to standard you get a pretty decent color spectrum on the finished  product, however, this is currently not what is happening when transcoding.

Ill just have to wait until some of the updates the guys have made trickle down into the stable release. :)

 

image.thumb.png.2c72fdca6bb2a751cc2478e0f746a7c8.png

 

Edited by IronBeardKnight
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2 hours ago, IronBeardKnight said:

Its true i could have multiple files however this is not an adequate storage solution.

What is the point of having transcoding if it cannot be utilized for its intended purpose.

It's actually the best solution possible as no transcoding is needed and you get perfect playback by using media designed especially for the resolution and bitrate.  Don't know how much you know about adaptive streaming done by all the major websites but there is a different file for every possible resolution and bitrate.  It's not uncommon for each movie or TV Episode on their sites to have been master 12 different ways and that was with 1080 media.  When you get into 4K you're adding additional version of the same media.

You don't think Amazon and Netflix have one version of the media and convert on the fly do you?  No way, they pre-convert the different versions, store them all so no real-time transcoding takes place.  When you convert in real-time you ARE loosing quality compared to a proper conversion that takes how ever long is needed which could easily be 4X to 5X run time length.  You can only do so much trying to process video quicker than it's consumed and that's just with one stream.  What if you have 3 or 4 transcodes going?  HW/GPU helps on the speed front but still is no where near as good as CPU based conversions.  BTW, it's the same way with YouTube videos as well.  There are multiple versions of each file so any client can "direct play" a single version.

Emby does a fantastic job with 1080 and lower resolution files on most average hardware and even does 4K SDR conversions quite well given a decent CPU/GPU but when you get into having to change every pixel color along with everything else you need to do to transcode in REAL-TIME it's near impossible on average consumer hardware for a Server.  The display/client side is a different story as it only need contend with one stream.

It's one thing to do tone mapping or similar type thing on a PC or device like a shield TV with dedicated hardware and quite another on a server sending streams to rokus, cell phones, web browser, dlna, TVs, etc and that's just the "pure video" conversion.  Now imagine having to factor in subtitle burn in on top of this, converting to h.265 or h.264 depending on client.  It's a massive amount of processing.

So while many are spoiled with Emby's ability to transcode on the fly for 1080p and lower SDR content, 4K HDR is another ball game you've stepped into and takes proper admin planning for these files and how they will get used.

For most people a Bluray rip of 4K HDR material is usable only on LAN and not remotely (most not all). You could certainly also master a much lower bitrate version such as 8 to 10 mbps 4K HDR to have much better luck streaming remotely (like what Netflix and Amazon Prime due).  But as stated previously you want the 4K version to be the 2nd version added to the system with a 1080 version being the primary so it's the main file used or transcoded from vs the 4K HDR version which for now should never be transcoded.

Will this change in the future? Sure, with newer approaches, newer algorithms, newer GPUs that can do this in HW but Emby can't snap it's fingers and make this work across the board for every Emby Server, as it's just not possible at present.

If you think of transcoding as a crutch to having proper versions like Netflix and others have it helps with understanding what can and can't be done with transcoding. Transcoding can convert certain video codecs in real-time, it can convert basically any audio format to another and can convert most subtitle formats to other formats to make them compatible with the client.  It can even repackage this into a different streaming container.  But even before getting into 4K media transcoding has issues with certain codecs that many machines can't handle like VC-1.  Even when it can do this transcoding it's not optimal for all clients.  For example if you have only 6 mb bandwidth to the client and the device/client can use h.265 that would be the optimal target for conversion of video as quality is better than h.264 for the same bitrate but that's far more CPU intensive and not all GPUs can convert to h.265 while most can decode it.  That plays into 4K as well as one of the popular video codecs is 10 bit H.265. 

So real time transcoding of 4K 10 bit H.265 mostly likely has to downgrade resolution to 1080 or lower, has to massively reduce the bitrate used while also using a less efficient codec like h.264 while changing the 10 bit to 8 bit and that's even before having to tone map color changes, burn in subtitles or touch/modify audio.

The moral of the story is that if you want 4K media in Emby and want things to work smoothly you add a 1080p version first to your standard movie library, then add the 4K media to it's own 4K library where only people with the ability to play it back direct can access it.

None of this is meant to be an excuse, but just the reality of where we are industry wide of what can/can't be done and how other system handle things.  In today's streaming setups you sacrifice storage which is cheap compared to CPU to accomplish different streaming resolutions.

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vdatanet
7 minutes ago, Luke said:

We're always working on supporting the latest and greatest formats.

Before supporting AV1, please add full support for streaming HEVC HDR for Apple TV 😃 (a.k.a. HLS using fMP4 container)

Edited by vdatanet
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I'd love to see HEVC optionally used instead of AVC as well when transcoding for clients that can play HEVC as it would require less bandwidth. Most modern GPU can both decode and encode HEVC as well.

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  • 2 weeks later...
IronBeardKnight
On 8/10/2020 at 3:24 PM, cayars said:

It's actually the best solution possible as no transcoding is needed and you get perfect playback by using media designed especially for the resolution and bitrate.  Don't know how much you know about adaptive streaming done by all the major websites but there is a different file for every possible resolution and bitrate.  It's not uncommon for each movie or TV Episode on their sites to have been master 12 different ways and that was with 1080 media.  When you get into 4K you're adding additional version of the same media.

You don't think Amazon and Netflix have one version of the media and convert on the fly do you?  No way, they pre-convert the different versions, store them all so no real-time transcoding takes place.  When you convert in real-time you ARE loosing quality compared to a proper conversion that takes how ever long is needed which could easily be 4X to 5X run time length.  You can only do so much trying to process video quicker than it's consumed and that's just with one stream.  What if you have 3 or 4 transcodes going?  HW/GPU helps on the speed front but still is no where near as good as CPU based conversions.  BTW, it's the same way with YouTube videos as well.  There are multiple versions of each file so any client can "direct play" a single version.

Emby does a fantastic job with 1080 and lower resolution files on most average hardware and even does 4K SDR conversions quite well given a decent CPU/GPU but when you get into having to change every pixel color along with everything else you need to do to transcode in REAL-TIME it's near impossible on average consumer hardware for a Server.  The display/client side is a different story as it only need contend with one stream.

It's one thing to do tone mapping or similar type thing on a PC or device like a shield TV with dedicated hardware and quite another on a server sending streams to rokus, cell phones, web browser, dlna, TVs, etc and that's just the "pure video" conversion.  Now imagine having to factor in subtitle burn in on top of this, converting to h.265 or h.264 depending on client.  It's a massive amount of processing.

So while many are spoiled with Emby's ability to transcode on the fly for 1080p and lower SDR content, 4K HDR is another ball game you've stepped into and takes proper admin planning for these files and how they will get used.

For most people a Bluray rip of 4K HDR material is usable only on LAN and not remotely (most not all). You could certainly also master a much lower bitrate version such as 8 to 10 mbps 4K HDR to have much better luck streaming remotely (like what Netflix and Amazon Prime due).  But as stated previously you want the 4K version to be the 2nd version added to the system with a 1080 version being the primary so it's the main file used or transcoded from vs the 4K HDR version which for now should never be transcoded.

Will this change in the future? Sure, with newer approaches, newer algorithms, newer GPUs that can do this in HW but Emby can't snap it's fingers and make this work across the board for every Emby Server, as it's just not possible at present.

If you think of transcoding as a crutch to having proper versions like Netflix and others have it helps with understanding what can and can't be done with transcoding. Transcoding can convert certain video codecs in real-time, it can convert basically any audio format to another and can convert most subtitle formats to other formats to make them compatible with the client.  It can even repackage this into a different streaming container.  But even before getting into 4K media transcoding has issues with certain codecs that many machines can't handle like VC-1.  Even when it can do this transcoding it's not optimal for all clients.  For example if you have only 6 mb bandwidth to the client and the device/client can use h.265 that would be the optimal target for conversion of video as quality is better than h.264 for the same bitrate but that's far more CPU intensive and not all GPUs can convert to h.265 while most can decode it.  That plays into 4K as well as one of the popular video codecs is 10 bit H.265. 

So real time transcoding of 4K 10 bit H.265 mostly likely has to downgrade resolution to 1080 or lower, has to massively reduce the bitrate used while also using a less efficient codec like h.264 while changing the 10 bit to 8 bit and that's even before having to tone map color changes, burn in subtitles or touch/modify audio.

The moral of the story is that if you want 4K media in Emby and want things to work smoothly you add a 1080p version first to your standard movie library, then add the 4K media to it's own 4K library where only people with the ability to play it back direct can access it.

None of this is meant to be an excuse, but just the reality of where we are industry wide of what can/can't be done and how other system handle things.  In today's streaming setups you sacrifice storage which is cheap compared to CPU to accomplish different streaming resolutions.

HOLY WALL OF TEXT! 

In advance @cayars thank you for your reply although long :)


I'm well aware of media and container formats however I am not Netflix nor am i Amazon so funding that many storage drives is not an option for my circumstances lol.

I'm just a guy with with a few movies, alot of home video's and photos and a lot of different sized devices ahahaha.

Well aware that multiply file formats are the most efficient for the none conservative but why convert in advance when you can convert on demand :)

Love your product @Luke its a banger, I look forward to seeing your advancements to it going forward and hope for more media conversion work and plugins in the future. 

Cheers

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