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Closed captions - Subtitles on live TV with hdhomerun?

Cc subtitles hdhomerun

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#21 Uuugh OFFLINE  

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Posted 22 September 2017 - 09:31 PM

Does this issue need to be opened elsewhere like github? HDHomerun is obviously sending the cc info but EMBY is not "processing" it.

 

Thanks



#22 ghostquito OFFLINE  

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 08:29 PM

I think this is more then just the CC, i don't see any options to select multiple audio sources either. Some programs have a spanish and english audio feed. For some reason i'll click a stream it will play in spanish, if i keep closing and opening it eventually it will play English. Not sure how it's detecting what audio to play, but regardless we need a way to select audio sources in the apps.



#23 neush1 OFFLINE  

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 10:44 PM

I'm having this issue also. No option for closed captions in either Live TV or TV recordings from my HDHomeRun within Emby Theater or the iOS client. When I open my recorded .ts files in VLC captions are available so I know they're in the stream and are getting saved correctly.



#24 horizonbrave OFFLINE  

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Posted 25 September 2018 - 12:58 AM

any update please? I'm also interested in the HDHomeRun product.. but wouldn't buy it if closed captions not available.

I'm in Australia. Cheers :)



#25 Luke OFFLINE  

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Posted 25 September 2018 - 12:53 PM

Closed captions and subtitles are two different things. We still have work to do regarding closed captions. Thanks.



#26 neush1 OFFLINE  

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Posted 25 September 2018 - 02:01 PM

Closed captions and subtitles are two different things. We still have work to do regarding closed captions. Thanks.

 

Luke, I'm curious what the technical issue with this still is? It's been nearly a year since this was first reported. I'm not ragging on anyone but it just seems like this would be an easy fix. The captions are encoded into the .ts file by HDHomerun. VLC can play them. Is there something missing from MPV that prevents these from being loaded? I'm curious if more information or logging would help to get this resolved.



#27 Luke OFFLINE  

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Posted 25 September 2018 - 02:46 PM

Because the two things are the same in the user's eyes, but very different in terms of how they are stored within the video container.



#28 clarkss12 OFFLINE  

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Posted 25 September 2018 - 02:54 PM

Closed captions on live TV from within the Emby app, would make it NEAR perfection.  I watch everything with CC or subtitles turned on, but Live TV is missing those, in their Live TV function.



#29 neush1 OFFLINE  

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Posted 25 September 2018 - 03:02 PM

Because the two things are the same in the user's eyes, but very different in terms of how they are stored within the video container.

 

Let me make sure I'm using the correct terminology then. When I record a TV show through Emby to disk I get an mpeg2 .ts file. After the show is completed, if I load that file into VLC I can view the descriptive text of what the character dialog is on the show I've recorded. It's my understanding that this is the CC track encoded by the broadcaster, correct? HDHomerun is clearly passing this through the stream to the file or else VLC couldn't display it. It also displays when I load these .ts files in WMC or record them through WMC directly. The issue is that even though this track is viewable through VLC, it's not viewable through Emby Theater. Any idea why?


Edited by neush1, 25 September 2018 - 03:03 PM.


#30 cayars OFFLINE  

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Posted 25 September 2018 - 04:31 PM

Just like there is a video and audio stream, there can be one or more subtitle streams as well. Subtitles can also be loaded from external files as well.  There are also a few different subtitle formats but they basically fall into two groups which are graphic based and text based.  SRT is one of the more popular subtitle formats and is text based.

 

With broadcast TV (US) they don't use subtitles but instead use Closed Captions.  CC is embedded in the video signal (Line 21) and is not a separate stream like a subtitle.  CC is essentially text based as well but since it's embedded in the video it has characteristics of being graphic as well as you have to process the video to get the CC (unlike SRT subs).

 

Therefore how you handle the two is apples and oranges.


Edited by cayars, 01 October 2018 - 03:10 PM.


#31 neush1 OFFLINE  

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Posted 26 September 2018 - 04:52 PM

In the US subtitles are a completely different stream that is part of the transport or file.  Just like there is a video and audio stream, there can be one or more subtitle streams as well. Subtitles can also be loaded from external files as well.  There are also a few different subtitle formats but they basically fall into two groups which are graphic based and text based.  SRT is one of the more popular subtitle formats and is text based.

 

With broadcast TV they don't use subtitles but instead use Closed Captions.  CC is embedded in the video signal (in a funky way) and is not a separate stream like a subtitle.  CC is essentially text based as well but since it's embedded in the video it has characteristics of being graphic as well as you have to process the video to get the CC (unlike SRT subs).

 

Therefore how you handle the two is apples and oranges.

 

This is helpful in understanding how CC works, thank you. I guess the thing I'm still not getting is VLC can render Closed Captions in the same file. WMC can render the Closed Captions in the same file. Why can't Emby? Is it an issue with Emby itself or with MPV? This is a serious accessibility issue for people who are deaf or hard of hearing and seems like it would be prioritized over other feature requests.



#32 cayars OFFLINE  

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Posted 26 September 2018 - 05:15 PM

VLC and WMC are local file based players that can also handle streams.  WMC was built for this type of thing.  VLC is the swiss-knife of video players and why it is so popular.

 

BUT, when you start getting into things like using Rokus, Xboxes, Android, iOS, ect the players used mainly on these systems didn't have CC as a goal per say.  These players were designed for internet streaming as the first goal and they wouldn't use CC but instead would use subtitles.

 

CC (in the US) is a completely different beast as pointed out earlier so this functionality isn't in the players or is starting to get supported due to people wanting to use them with systems like Emby.

 

This is sort of a secondary goal for the players as the only use is for TV and not your typical internet streaming from all the major sites as they wouldn't use CC.

 

Without getting too technical, hope that helps shed some light on it.  It's in the works on many platforms at the player level.



#33 neush1 OFFLINE  

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Posted 01 October 2018 - 02:04 PM

VLC and WMC are local file based players that can also handle streams.  WMC was built for this type of thing.  VLC is the swiss-knife of video players and why it is so popular.

 

BUT, when you start getting into things like using Rokus, Xboxes, Android, iOS, ect the players used mainly on these systems didn't have CC as a goal per say.  These players were designed for internet streaming as the first goal and they wouldn't use CC but instead would use subtitles.

 

CC (in the US) is a completely different beast as pointed out earlier so this functionality isn't in the players or is starting to get supported due to people wanting to use them with systems like Emby.

 

This is sort of a secondary goal for the players as the only use is for TV and not your typical internet streaming from all the major sites as they wouldn't use CC.

 

Without getting too technical, hope that helps shed some light on it.  It's in the works on many platforms at the player level.

 

Thanks cayars. I appreciate your willingness to break these down for me and help me understand what's going on. I've done a lot of searching the last few days because I need a fix for this. My wife is hard of hearing and CC is vital to us being able to use something like Emby longterm. I also understand Plex has this same issue, in fact I think I've seen some of your posts about this over on those forums as well. I think I have a better understanding of how CC differs from subtitles but from what I've seen MPV is supposed to handle CC streams, is that correct? This update on github seems to indicate that CC decoding is now working on MPV using ffmpeg. If this works, can't we get this working in Emby as well?



#34 cayars OFFLINE  

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Posted 01 October 2018 - 02:58 PM

Actually Emby should be able to support CEA-608 closed captions (Line 21) for Android already in HLS and DASH if they set up the declarations.

https://medium.com/g...ew-847ea8e06709 gives an overview.

https://google.githu...ed-formats.html

 

MPV supports CC on the desktop version but I'm not sure about the Android version.  I honestly haven't played with this version.  I'm sure there are many people here on the forum that could answer this.

 

I've got a small util that runs pretty quickly that can extract CEA-608 (Line 21) CC info and create SRT subtitles which could be ran from post processing.  This would help with anything recorded but not for Live-TV.  Of course VLC could be used (for now) for this to get by.


Edited by cayars, 01 October 2018 - 03:01 PM.






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