Completed Request - Remove Series Pooling

[dcook 265]

Please remove Series Pooling, or at the very least make it an Optional Setting

[Deathsquirrel 741]

Definitely don't disable it.  If this IS made an option perhaps it could be made an option on the Library, 'Do not use series pooling for folders in this library'.

 

I would MUCH rather see changes to the server that allow better handling of the material that prompts this request.  For example if I were keeping one copy of a series in English and one in French, and for some reason I didn't want to just merge the audio tracks in to a single set of files, the UI could merge the episodes and when I go to play them, ask me which copy to play.  In that scenario it should remember that preferences for that show during that play session so it didn't ask me again for each episode.

[bfir3 113]

Definitely don't disable it.  If this IS made an option perhaps it could be made an option on the Library, 'Do not use series pooling for folders in this library'.

 

I would MUCH rather see changes to the server that allow better handling of the material that prompts this request.  For example if I were keeping one copy of a series in English and one in French, and for some reason I didn't want to just merge the audio tracks in to a single set of files, the UI could merge the episodes and when I go to play them, ask me which copy to play.  In that scenario it should remember that preferences for that show during that play session so it didn't ask me again for each episode.

 

Agreed. I think series pooling should be a transparent feature that applies everywhere but has no adverse affects on other users. I'm not totally clear on the issue, but my understanding of it is that Series Pooling was implemented to merge episodes of one series that were contained in multiple directories into one single parent item on Emby. This makes it so that if people have recordings, and dvd backups in different locations, they can still see all of their episodes in one place. The problem with this only comes into play when users have split up a series in order to duplicate it based on quality/language or any other reason. In this case it becomes difficult for these users to manage their media, and I assume it is because the episodes appear under the season level with no indication of which "version" of the episode it is until you actually click on or open that episode? If that's the only problem the @@Deathsquirrel's solution to instead of displaying each duplicate episode, only display one item per unique parent/child index and allow the user to select which copy of this particular parent child index to play when they desire it.

[dcook 265]

If people split up their physical library then there was a reason for it, we don't need EMBY to try to fix a problem that does not exist.  

 

If I wanted all my library grouped together I would have done that.

 

Like I said, if this "feature" is needed for maybe the 0.01% of the people who save the same show in many different places then at the very least it should be an optional feature.

 

99% of us don't need this so-called "feature" it just causes problems and goes against the planning and logic that was put into how to organize and store my media and setup my library.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Agreed. I think series pooling should be a transparent feature that applies everywhere but has no adverse affects on other users. I'm not totally clear on the issue, but my understanding of it is that Series Pooling was implemented to merge episodes of one series that were contained in multiple directories into one single parent item on Emby. This makes it so that if people have recordings, and dvd backups in different locations, they can still see all of their episodes in one place. The problem with this only comes into play when users have split up a series in order to duplicate it based on quality/language or any other reason. In this case it becomes difficult for these users to manage their media, and I assume it is because the episodes appear under the season level with no indication of which "version" of the episode it is until you actually click on or open that episode? If that's the only problem the @@Deathsquirrel's solution to instead of displaying each duplicate episode, only display one item per unique parent/child index and allow the user to select which copy of this particular parent child index to play when they desire it.

[ebr 14902]

If people split up their physical library then there was a reason for it, we don't need EMBY to try to fix a problem that does not exist.  

 

 

We already do not pool between different libraries.  95% of cases where people want the items separate they can still have that by putting them in separate libraries.

 

The issue arises when you put different variations of the same series in different places within the same library and that is quite rare.

 

The point of this feature (which was requested heavily for a long time) is for people who do not use large servers with drive-pooling solutions and, instead just add hard discs as needed.  In this scenario, they end up with season 3 of a series on a different physical disc than seasons 1 and 2 and, without pooling, these show up as two separate series.  With this feature, these show up as a single series with their physical layout completely transparent to the end user (which is what most people would want).

 

This behavior is consistent with other media aggregation products.

 

Now, that doesn't mean that an option won't happen.  I just wanted it to be clear to all readers what the feature is and why it exists.

[dcook 265]

It makes no sense to store different parts of a series on different drives.  

I don't know why anyone would do that, so I will stick by my 0.01% that would ever do that.

 

Your trying to make EMBY which is already a great media server now become a file management server or media aggregation as you called it, it is best to let EMBY do what it does great and if someone wants to use aggregation products they can.

 

I request that this feature be removed, or at the very least optional.  

 

Anyone who manages a decent sized server and collection will have planned it properly and have their media stored how they want, and don't need EMBY for this.

 

Forcing this change on us, because of the 0.01% idiots who have 15 USB drives attached to their computer, and wants to "pool them all together" is not fair.

Edited September 1, 2016 by dcook

[ebr 14902]

It makes no sense to store different parts of a series on different drives.  

I don't know why anyone would do that, so I will stick by my 0.01% that would ever do that.

 

They don't do it on purpose per se.  It happens because a drive fills up and they have no choice.

[Deathsquirrel 741]

It makes no sense to store different parts of a series on different drives.  

I don't know why anyone would do that, so I will stick by my 0.01% that would ever do that.

 

Your trying to make EMBY which is already a great media server now become a file management server or media aggregation as you called it, it is best to let EMBY do what it does great and if someone wants to use aggregation products they can.

 

I request that this feature be removed, or at the very least optional.  

 

Anyone who manages a decent sized server and collection will have planned it properly and have their media stored how they want, and don't need EMBY for this.

 

Forcing this change on us, because of the 0.01% idiots who have 15 USB drives attached to their computer, and wants to "pool them all together" is not fair.

 

 

As an apparent 'idiot' let me explain very simply how this happens.  I rip my Star Trek TNG DVDs.  Along comes Blu-Rays and I buy season 1 and 2 and replace those DVD rips.  I buy some more movies and they go in a different folder on the same drive.  Now season 3 is out on blu and I buy that but that drive is full...so minus this feature I've always just moved the whole series to a drive that has room for that whole series in HD, done a new scan and database cleanup, and called it a day.

 

I totally understand, my server configuration of separate internal drives makes me a moron but this feature saves me time.  I never requested it personally but it's nice to have now that it's here.  I know, shame on me for not psychically divining the future release schedule of new HD copies of my SD content but I kinda appreciate Luke making my server maintenance easier.  Maybe we should look for an option that meets your needs without shitting all over fellow users.  It's a notion.

[CBers 6766]

Please remove Series Pooling, or at the very least make it an Optional Setting

Isn't this a duplicate of this:

 

http://emby.media/community/index.php?/topic/37462-deactivate-series-pooling/

[mgworek 121]

It is also helpful for people with large servers with drive pooling solutions so that we can just spin one drive up instead of all our drives. I know when I first came here I was sad that wasn't already a feature when the product i previously used had it. Now that it is a feature, I haven't switched to it yet but do plan on testing it out.

[earthtorob 5]

I don't use the pooling feature, at least not intentionally.  But if people split up their media because they have different versions of the same video then couldn't they just edit the metadata?

 

Ash Vs Evil Dead (us)

Ash Vs Evil Dead (french)

Ash Vs Evil Dead (720p)

 

Perhaps Emby could create separate groups for different versions of the same video based on the folder location and give the user a one-click option to merge them?

 

I'm not a programmer so I don't know how much trouble this would be.

[willo123 5]

Funny that no one has mentioned IMO the most important use case for pooling: offline media. To meaningfully manage offline media, at least if you maintain  stubs in automated manner (such as creating them per script based on dvdprofiler) uoi will need to have separate root folder for offline media. However, since I, and I am fairly sure this would apply to just about anyone, want to see a specific show, not so much whatever I happen to have on bluray or dvd, pooling is essential.

[PurposelyCryptic 31]

Isn't this a duplicate of this:

 

http://emby.media/community/index.php?/topic/37462-deactivate-series-pooling/

 

I posted in that thread since it seemed more active, asking/pleading about an update on when/if this feature will be made optional,(it has made a mess of my library), but it occurred to me that posting here might be more appropriate/effective; that thread was in server support, despite amounting to a feature request (albeit a feature removal request), whereas this one is an actual feature request.

 

Not sure if that thread should be moved/merged or such, but I wanted to at least voice my utmost support for this feature here as well. Not necessarily removing pooling - I'm sure it's probably incredibly useful to someone out there, somewhere, or else it wouldn't have been implemented; but please, please make it optional, for those of us for whom all it does is create a giant, unfixable mess. A simple toggle is all we ask. Even a checkbox will do. Just let us kill it. Preferably with fire.

[Angelblue05 4130]

Maybe if you give a concrete example of why series pooling is messing up your library? This way it can be taken into consideration. From what I see, series pooling only applies for items within the same library. The solution would be to split your library accordingly, because logically, if they are in the same library, they should belong to the same series.

[ebr 14902]

The example is in the thread he referenced.  The problem comes when people physically separate the same series within the same library for personal organization reasons (like different languages).  It is pretty rare, but does exist for some people.

[PurposelyCryptic 31]

Maybe if you give a concrete example of why series pooling is messing up your library? This way it can be taken into consideration. From what I see, series pooling only applies for items within the same library. The solution would be to split your library accordingly, because logically, if they are in the same library, they should belong to the same series.

 

 

Sorry, I tried to keep my post in this thread short, since I had only just posted in more detail in the thread that was referenced in the post I replied to (trying to avoid double-posting, etc), but I guess that only made sense under the assumption people had also read that thread. I'm just going to go ahead and quote my other post below to simplify things:

 

 

Not trying to be a pain to you devs (I love you guys, really!), but I have to reiterate this request for an update, as the automatic series pooling implementation has seriously affected Emby's basic day-to-day usability for me.

 

This may seem like a trivial, nit-picky issue to some people, but for those of us negatively affected by it, it's a serious problem. In my situation, where I have a mid-large library of anime (1.8k series), and often archive multiple versions of series based on source, subtitle quality, etc., it has not only made it mostly impossible to distinguish which is which (since they now all share one meta-data entry, with one title and description), but has also made simply browsing though a series an exercise in ridiculousness, as to get from episode 1 to 2 I have to browse past every alternate version of episode 1 first (again, with no way of telling them apart).

 

It is particularly problematic since (and please correct me if I'm wrong in this) the issue doesn't seem to lie with how Emby collects meta-data, but how it interprets it, so even using an alternate meta-data provider would lead to the same result as long as the tvdb id matches (and going back to MCM or metabrowser, if they still exist, would likely drive me nuts, anyhow).

 

Any news at all would be welcome - if it's been implemented in the dev branch, awesome, I'll switch to that immediately, but even being told that it's a low-to-zero priority that won't be addressed for months, if then, would be helpful, albeit sad; I'd have to figure out how to best go about downgrading Emby to before the change, and finding compatible versions of all the plugins, but at least I'd know to do that.

 

Thanks in advance for any info!

 

Anyhoo, as ebr mentioned, the non-optional nature of the series pooling system can cause problems big and small for anyone keeping multiple separate versions of anything, amongst other things. I've seen references to different issues in other threads/posts as well, primarily affecting those who spent years carefully building, organizing and curating larger libraries using criteria outside of the one-size-fits-all mold.

 

For me, the biggest issue is that I keep multiple versions of shows, with different audio languages, different subtitles from various translation groups, alternate editions, censored/uncensored versions, etc. Having them all thrown into one pot makes for a disaster. Not only can I no longer see them as separate entries, but navigating the sole entry left means having to browse past multiple virtually indistinguishable instances of each episode.

 

Splitting my libraries is not really an option here - while I could technically create separate libraries each for audio track languages and have english, german, french, japanese and "multi" libraries, not only would that be hideously chaotic, it would do nothing for the various individual versions amongst those categories.

 

This one-size-fits all, one-number-is-one entry system likely works great with small or simple libraries, and I can definitely see the convenience for those who have individual shows spread across drives: When it doesn't cause you issues, it's like magic, requiring zero organizational effort, as Emby takes care of it all for you. But when you've spent the better part of a decade carefully organizing multiple versions of thousands of shows, having the system suddenly take all your individually hand-customized metadata and put it in a blender so it can organize everything under one header is... frustrating.

 

So, before I get anymore overly-wordy, I'll stop myself here, and just say that, while I completely understand your enthusiasm for this feature and wanting to help us crotchety-old-man-type people adapt to live with it, there are quite a few of us for whom it just isn't going to work. So please, please, let us turn it off. It doesn't have to be a toggle, switch, or even  be directly integrated into Emby Server - it could be a plug-in, so it would clearly show up in diagnostic logs. Like the XML metadata saver, which is also greatly loved by those of us the crotchety-old-man crowd. Just let us turn it off, somehow. Still preferably with fire.

[eTomm 4]

I have the problem too for different languages... In fact the problem would be reduced to zero if you would be able to set on what the pooling should be done. At the end, a show, in two different language is not the same show.

[Happy2Play 8239]

I have the problem too for different languages... In fact the problem would be reduced to zero if you would be able to set on what the pooling should be done. At the end, a show, in two different language is not the same show.

True but according to metadata providers they are the exact same show.  Since language doesn't change any ids give by any metadata provider.

[eTomm 4]

True but according to metadata providers they are the exact same show.  Since language doesn't change any ids give by any metadata provider.

 

True but metadata provider is there to help people and Emby (and the other) recognize a show. The Library is just there to help people organize them... at that point the fact that metadata ids are the same should be just a part of the code behind the Equals method To be truly equals they should have at least the same language too I think. 

 

I really would like to meet a person that downloads two folder, sets them to download metadata in two different languages in emby and then will consider everything the same show.

 

The only case that I can see is someone downloading the last season of a series in another language and save it in another folder for a better organization and wanting it merged all together in the library.... but this is clearly a excess of organization.

[mtjj 31]

I don't use the pooling feature, at least not intentionally.  But if people split up their media because they have different versions of the same video then couldn't they just edit the metadata?

 

Ash Vs Evil Dead (us)

Ash Vs Evil Dead (french)

Ash Vs Evil Dead (720p)

 

...

 

Posting in this thread as I've encountered the same problem - multiple language versions of the same file. I really appreciate the work the developers put in, so I'm trying to be constructive rather than just shout abuse and demands, so a question regarding whether it's possible to get the right result by manually editing the metadata:

 

For movies, I let the metadata download automatically, then go in and manually adjust the title as desired, so I add [italian dub] or whatever and lock the name - I have to do this anyway since IMDB and TMDB don't generally store the correct name for movies titled in non-latin characters. This results in what I want - the same movie showing up multiple times with different titles - as in the quote above.

 

But for TV, I can't get the same result thanks to series pooling - so the question is, can I adjust the metadata manually? Is there a way to edit the nfo file to remove the series ID, change the name, and lock it so that Emby sees it as a different series and doesn't overwrite it? In my case the number of series I have in multiple versions is quite small - manual workarounds are OK as long as it only has to be done once and doesn't get overwritten when Emby does an update

 

And thanks to the developers for all the work put in to Emby - issues like this don't take away from how great the program is generally.

[tatumana 105]

3 month i wish this. Devs don't want to undestand the problem with this feature.

 

Envoyé de mon GT-I9505 en utilisant Tapatalk

[tatumana 105]

In plus, Luke love to answer by another question. I think devs don't want to do anything about that. They just waiting our weariness.

 

Envoyé de mon GT-I9505 en utilisant Tapatalk

[ebr 14902]

We are definitely listening but things are not always as simple as they may seem from the user standpoint.

 

Plus, we have to prioritize items and this feature request, while I'm sure very important to you, has only garnered 2 votes.

[dcook 265]

Funny how you can implement an unwanted feature so quickly, but to turn it off, or simply make it optional now is a big problem

Edited November 1, 2016 by dcook

[Luke 36999]

I was really just asking a question to try and collect additional information. While adding a setting is OK, it would be even better to just have it work out of the box, so if the server can predict the situations where it shouldn't group them, then I would like to pursue that. If this turns out to not be possible then obviously we'll adjust but right now that is why I'm asking these questions.