MagicDoubleM 93 Posted September 7, 2022 Share Posted September 7, 2022 So, I did play a little with some DSD-files (DSF-WV to be precise) which I'd like to integrate into my music collection, and they get recognized fine (well, they're WV-files). - the web-player does actually get some sound out, but Emby decides to transcode to AAC with 384kbit/s - the android app didn't find a playable stream - but hey, the androidTV-app seems to decode the files on the client device These tests were done with 2.0 files, but there is 5.1 too. So, I'm not sure if this is a bug report or feature request, since I don't think DSD was officially announced as supported, and just came in through the backdoor with wavpacks updates, but I’d love to see that supported properly, which basically means those files should be decoded on the client side to whatever it's audio-device supports as max. Bonus points would be given for more transcoding targets, like flac24/96, flac24/48, flac16/48, for cases when transcoding is needed due to bandwidth reasons or clients not being able to decode DSD. AAC also supports 24bit, so thats an interesting option too, to keep a bit higher quality intact from these sources. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke 37007 Posted September 7, 2022 Share Posted September 7, 2022 Quote the web-player does actually get some sound out, but Emby decides to transcode to AAC with 384kbit/s Hi, this is expected. Web browsers do not support dsd. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke 37007 Posted September 7, 2022 Share Posted September 7, 2022 Quote the android app didn't find a playable stream Hi, yes this is on our to do list to resolve. Thanks. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicDoubleM 93 Posted September 7, 2022 Author Share Posted September 7, 2022 54 minutes ago, Luke said: Hi, this is expected. Web browsers do not support dsd. Yes, sure, but Chromium for example natively supports FLAC and PCM (up to 32bit), which would be much better transcoding-targets for HD-audio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke 37007 Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 Hi, yes we can certainly look at improving that. Thanks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Branches 231 Posted April 10, 2023 Share Posted April 10, 2023 I can add something if it's still unreported: My AV receiver has DSD playback support for up to 2.8 Mhz but the Emby for Android TV app is transcoding the codec to AAC instead of passing it through to the AV receiver, however, given the fact that the app is still not passing through anything beyond 2 channels and with more than 48Khz I imagine this is expected. Let me know if you need a transcode log. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke 37007 Posted April 10, 2023 Share Posted April 10, 2023 17 hours ago, Richard Branches said: I can add something if it's still unreported: My AV receiver has DSD playback support for up to 2.8 Mhz but the Emby for Android TV app is transcoding the codec to AAC instead of passing it through to the AV receiver, however, given the fact that the app is still not passing through anything beyond 2 channels and with more than 48Khz I imagine this is expected. Let me know if you need a transcode log. Hi. Can you try sideloading our standard android app on the same device and see how that compares? https://emby.media/emby-for-android.html Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Branches 231 Posted April 10, 2023 Share Posted April 10, 2023 I got the same error message that appears on Android mobile: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visproduction 122 Posted April 14, 2023 Share Posted April 14, 2023 (edited) Quick look up on DSD, I don't find that TCP can support it. Doesn't that mean the DSD file transfer has to travel separately over Ethernet and is not compatible for Wifi at all? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_audio_network_protocols https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AES50 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravenna_(networking) How can a completely separate protocol be called and confirmed that a connection has been made to a qualified AV amplifier and then monitored when the streaming is done, from inside a TCP/IP streaming app, like Emby? How would Emby know if DSD stream does not make a valid connection? It seems like you would either need a hardware converter box to handle this switching or use software conversion, like it is now. Is there an AV amp that tests and sends a TCP awk packet confirming that a good connection has been made? I never heard of this happening? I think AV designers just expect the DSD playback traffic to be directly connected from a hardware player through digital audio or high quality cable line input. Do they even bother offering DSD over Ethernet at all? DSD appears to be currently incompatible with TCP based media player. Is there some design option I am missing? Edited April 14, 2023 by visproduction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicDoubleM 93 Posted April 17, 2023 Author Share Posted April 17, 2023 (edited) On 4/14/2023 at 2:35 PM, visproduction said: Quick look up on DSD, I don't find that TCP can support it. Doesn't that mean the DSD file transfer has to travel separately over Ethernet and is not compatible for Wifi at all? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_audio_network_protocols https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AES50 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravenna_(networking) How can a completely separate protocol be called and confirmed that a connection has been made to a qualified AV amplifier and then monitored when the streaming is done, from inside a TCP/IP streaming app, like Emby? How would Emby know if DSD stream does not make a valid connection? It seems like you would either need a hardware converter box to handle this switching or use software conversion, like it is now. Is there an AV amp that tests and sends a TCP awk packet confirming that a good connection has been made? I never heard of this happening? I think AV designers just expect the DSD playback traffic to be directly connected from a hardware player through digital audio or high quality cable line input. Do they even bother offering DSD over Ethernet at all? DSD appears to be currently incompatible with TCP based media player. Is there some design option I am missing? TCP isn't the value here, it's the network-protocol that gets the data from the emby-server to the client/app. That's the easiest part in all this, and this is all happening on levels emby doesn't have to touch. Now with the data having arrived in the memory of an emby-client there are two options. Emby has somehow pass the data to the player's hardware, so this can pass it through it's output to your receiver. And for that the makers of streaming devices have prepared software connections and APIs that allow bitstreaming of AC3/E-AC3/DTS for example. An app like emby does not access the hardware directly, those days are mostly over, it just passes the data through to another higher software-level. If, for example, amazon decides to not support DSD, because they don't want to pay for licenses, then that's basically game over. But, here is option two, what an app like emby can do, is handling the DSD-decoding by itself and output as PCM, much like things are done with FLAC and other formats that can't be bitstreamed. Edited April 18, 2023 by MagicDoubleM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Branches 231 Posted April 17, 2023 Share Posted April 17, 2023 (edited) 16 hours ago, MagicDoubleM said: what an app like emby can do, is handling the DSD-decoding by itself and output as PCM, much like things are done with FLAC and other formats that can't be bitstreamed. I would accept that as a solution, as far as the Emby for Android TV app fixes the current state where audio equal or higher than 88.2Khz gets resampled to 48Khz. Edited April 17, 2023 by Richard Branches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicDoubleM 93 Posted April 18, 2023 Author Share Posted April 18, 2023 (edited) 23 hours ago, Richard Branches said: I would accept that as a solution, as far as the Emby for Android TV app fixes the current state where audio equal or higher than 88.2Khz gets resampled to 48Khz. Thing is, some devices, like Amazon firesticks, natively support flac. I guess that's how emby handles this right now. Unfortunately, mentioned firesticks support flac only up to 24/48. So this might be the limiting factor here. However, the same devices support PCM up to 24/96. So decoding inside the app would be a good way. Of course the transcoding could happen on the emby-server too, even though this would be a bit heavier on the network. Edited April 18, 2023 by MagicDoubleM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Branches 231 Posted April 19, 2023 Share Posted April 19, 2023 I bought a FiiO KA1 USB-C DAC for my phone and I thought DSD playback was going to work but it didn't, the DAC has an RGB indicator light that changes depending on the format and audio quality, if DSD playback was possible, a green light would have appeared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Branches 231 Posted April 21, 2023 Share Posted April 21, 2023 (edited) I want to clarify something: If the Emby for Android app is going to provide DSD playback support as it should, then it must: - Implement the "Exclusive USB Audio Access Mode" option which is now in the Feature Requests section, this is necessary to output the DSD stream directly to a DAC with DSD playback support, otherwise, if the Android driver is used, then only PCM decoding is possible. - Implement the three audio options for DSD decoding: PCM, DoP (DSD over PCM) and DSD native, otherwise, if the Android driver is used, then only PCM decoding is possible. In my case with the FiiO KA1, PCM and DoP are supported by the DAC, but DoP is only possible with the "Exclusive USB Audio Access Mode" option. Edited April 23, 2023 by Richard Branches 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Music100 22 Posted October 9, 2023 Share Posted October 9, 2023 Hi, I'm using a Chord Qutest DAC with an emby server on Windows 10. Is there still no way to play DSD files natively without transcoding? Are there plans to implement this feature request? Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Branches 231 Posted October 9, 2023 Share Posted October 9, 2023 Not yet, I recommend to buy the USB Audio Player PRO app which it has full support in that regard while the Emby devs implement proper support. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke 37007 Posted October 9, 2023 Share Posted October 9, 2023 3 hours ago, Music100 said: Hi, I'm using a Chord Qutest DAC with an emby server on Windows 10. Is there still no way to play DSD files natively without transcoding? Are there plans to implement this feature request? Cheers Hi, what device and Emby app are you playing on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Music100 22 Posted October 9, 2023 Share Posted October 9, 2023 20 minutes ago, Luke said: Hi, what device and Emby app are you playing on? It's a Chord Qutest DAC. I am using Emby with Google Chrome on Windows 10. https://chordelectronics.co.uk/product/qutest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke 37007 Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 23 hours ago, Music100 said: It's a Chord Qutest DAC. I am using Emby with Google Chrome on Windows 10. https://chordelectronics.co.uk/product/qutest OK, there is currently no web browser can that can play DSD directly without the use of server transcoding. Why not try our Emby Theater app for windows? https://emby.media/emby-theater.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicDoubleM 93 Posted February 14 Author Share Posted February 14 Revisited this for a short little test, and for a change, my current FireCube (3rd gen) running the AndroidTV app gets an AAC 96khz transcode with high bitrates, 2.0 and 5.1 variants work both the same way. When I started the thread things worked differently, but I was on a different device too, so who knows. Nothing new in regard to playback in browsers and the Android-client on my phone, which still refuses to play those files at all. I'm at the latest betas. Fun sidenote, Symfonium does get an OGG/192kbit/s stream. So, yeah, DSD via Emby is still not a thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke 37007 Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 1 hour ago, MagicDoubleM said: Revisited this for a short little test, and for a change, my current FireCube (3rd gen) running the AndroidTV app gets an AAC 96khz transcode with high bitrates, 2.0 and 5.1 variants work both the same way. When I started the thread things worked differently, but I was on a different device too, so who knows. Nothing new in regard to playback in browsers and the Android-client on my phone, which still refuses to play those files at all. I'm at the latest betas. Fun sidenote, Symfonium does get an OGG/192kbit/s stream. So, yeah, DSD via Emby is still not a thing. Hi, we'll take another look at it. Thanks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Branches 231 Posted February 14 Share Posted February 14 15 hours ago, MagicDoubleM said: the AndroidTV app gets an AAC 96khz transcode At least you are getting 96Khz, on Android TV things are worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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